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Retro fitting Canti posts on Centerpull posts for Paul Racers?

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Retro fitting Canti posts on Centerpull posts for Paul Racers?

Old 12-16-14, 03:17 PM
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kimpw
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Retro fitting Canti posts on Centerpull posts for Paul Racers?

Hi,

I'm looking to get the Cycles Toussaint Velo Routier bike. A big selling point being that it has center pull brakes brazeons.

However, I want to use Paul Racers which use cantilever posts and are a bit larger in diameter than centerpull posts.

Can I just unscrew the center pull posts from the bosses and thread on canti posts? I was looking at getting Paragon Machinework posts that are Paul-specific (www.paragonmachineworks.com - BK2015SteelPaulComponentBrakeStud).

I thought the threading and width of the bosses were universal, but I could be wrong.
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Old 12-16-14, 03:24 PM
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unterhausen
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the posts are far from universal. You might get lucky. The web page for that bike says Paul brakes will not fit, and I'm guessing they would mention adapters. It might be possible to fabricate bushings though

the centerpull posts I'm familiar with do not have screw in posts, they are solid
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Old 12-17-14, 09:10 AM
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Does not look like thay will work. From the Cycles Toussaint web site:

"Paul Centre pull brakes WILL NOT work as they need cantilever braze-on brake posts with are larger in diameter than centre-pull brake post.
Cantilever and V- brakes will not fit. "

Get some center pulls and have at it. They will work very well with the braze on posts. Much stiffer than on a normal mounting.

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Old 12-17-14, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by kimpw View Post
Hi,

I'm looking to get the Cycles Toussaint Velo Routier bike. A big selling point being that it has center pull brakes brazeons.

However, I want to use Paul Racers which use cantilever posts and are a bit larger in diameter than centerpull posts.

Can I just unscrew the center pull posts from the bosses and thread on canti posts? I was looking at getting Paragon Machinework posts that are Paul-specific (www.paragonmachineworks.com - BK2015SteelPaulComponentBrakeStud).

I thought the threading and width of the bosses were universal, but I could be wrong.
I'm not sure that "having center pull braze-ons" is a big selling feature-

If the braze on location is such that meet Paul specs for post location, you should be alright. There is a pdf on the Paul site so you can verify the location. As for the post diameter, Paul supplies bushings the fit their brakes to standard brake post diameters, and every set of Paul brakes I've seen come with these bushings. If not they can be ordered from Paul.

Also, calling them "canti posts," is a bit confusing. Cantilever posts are in a different position relative to the wheel, and Paul Racer brakes will not work on standard canti-posts. It's about the position, not the post size.
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Old 12-17-14, 09:31 AM
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The issue isn't the posts themselves but the position. On a centerpull brake the shoes (and rim) are below the posts, while on canti and V-brakes the shoes are above the post (outward on the wheel).
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Old 12-17-14, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by rellis View Post
Does not look like thay will work. From the Cycles Toussaint web site:

"Paul Centre pull brakes WILL NOT work as they need cantilever braze-on brake posts with are larger in diameter than centre-pull brake post.
Cantilever and V- brakes will not fit. "

Get some center pulls and have at it. They will work very well with the braze on posts. Much stiffer than on a normal mounting.

Yeah, I sent them an email. But haven't heard back yet. I might just have to get dia compe 750's, but I just like to get as much made in USA products as possible within my budget. Plus I've liked all Paul products I've tried. I really like the Ocean Air Rambler, but I don't know if I can spend that much on frameset, plus I like threaded headsets

Also if anyone knows any frame builders in the DC metro area, please let me know.

Last edited by kimpw; 12-17-14 at 09:53 AM.
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Old 12-17-14, 10:02 AM
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they are called "canti posts" because you can go to your favorite vendor of frame parts and order cantilever posts and put them wherever you want. I assume the frame that the OP is interested in uses the Dia Compe posts that Compass sells. Note that the link says to use canti posts for Paul brakes

Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure that traditional center pull brakes will function if fitted to canti posts (in the right location, obviously). The main problem that I have found with center pull posts is that the proper pivot location is different for all of them. Paul's, Mafac Raids, Compass, and some of the Dia Compe are within a few mm of each other and will probably work fine. I'm really curious if there is actually a problem with this frame.
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Old 12-17-14, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by kimpw View Post
Hi,

I'm looking to get the Cycles Toussaint Velo Routier bike. A big selling point being that it has center pull brakes brazeons.

However, I want to use Paul Racers which use cantilever posts and are a bit larger in diameter than centerpull posts.

Can I just unscrew the center pull posts from the bosses and thread on canti posts? I was looking at getting Paragon Machinework posts that are Paul-specific (www.paragonmachineworks.com - BK2015SteelPaulComponentBrakeStud).

I thought the threading and width of the bosses were universal, but I could be wrong.
You are asking about a built up Bike Velo Routier 650B Randonneur Bicycle | Cycles Toussaint


Center pull, as shown, Boss is above the rim.. it needs to have the screw out post, to get out of the way. (does It?) a cantilever brake boss is Below The Rim .

Paul's Racer is their center pull .. Racer from Paul Component Engineering .. Racer Medium from Paul Component Engineering

You may want a different Frame Builder, if the brakes you really want are V/Cantilever type. Neo-Retro from Paul Component Engineering ..
Touring Canti from Paul Component Engineering


Paul uses a Stainless Bushing over standard posts, and the return springs do not anchor in the frame , the 2 parts are within each brake.
the counterforce is individually adjusted, with an open end wrench, and the anchor bolt in the center holds that tight.

U brakes in the BMX world , adjust like that Too .. a particularly Beefy center pull.

Last edited by fietsbob; 12-17-14 at 11:29 AM.
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Old 12-17-14, 11:35 AM
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Posts for centrepulls are shorter (10mm) that those for cantis, but the OD is the same. Like was said the spacing is more critical with centrepulls than for cantis.
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Old 12-17-14, 11:43 AM
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Hi, I guess to clarify...

I'm looking to use Paul Racers (Racer from Paul Component Engineering). These are centerpull brakes and also use centerpull brazeon posts. However, they use cantilever-type posts which are larger in diameter than traditional center pull posts. Still same placement as centerpull posts, but they use cantilever-type posts for some reason.

My guess is they use beefier posts for stiffness since the brakes are CNC machined and not forged. Mostly likely, I will just use a pair of Dia Comp 750's until I can locate a framebuilder in the DC metro area to make these changes.
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Old 12-17-14, 12:42 PM
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The sleeve , that is part of the Paul Made brake, slips Over a standard cantilever diameter sized Boss ,

it also has the O rings that keep the grease, between the bushing in the brake and the sleeve over the generic Post , Cleaner longer.
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Old 12-17-14, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by tuz View Post
Posts for centrepulls are shorter (10mm) that those for cantis, but the OD is the same. Like was said the spacing is more critical with centrepulls than for cantis.
I came to just conclusion looking at pictures online, but I didn't see any drawings that confirmed it. So the post isn't going to come all the way out to the end of the Paul pivot. Since the Paul pivot doesn't move, is this a matter of any consequence?

I have gotten really close to ordering a set of centerpull bosses, but I have a problem spending
$10 on a $4 part. Here is a blog post about the difference in these bosses

OP, I'm not sure you should bother clarifying the issue any more than you have.


I probably would consider the Compass brakes. Granted, they are a little more, but they fit this frame

Last edited by unterhausen; 12-17-14 at 01:00 PM.
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