i've been lurking for a while and posting on occasion, and i've noticed a trend or mindset here that has me a little confused to say the least.

i see a lot of posts along the lines of "kids are lazy! they should be out on bikes exercising! america is the most obese country in the world!" okay. that's not an exact quote, but the message is the same.

right alongside those threads are other posts that have such an elitist attitude to them it makes me want to throw up. who cares of someone's bike is 40 pounds and only cost 50 dollars. they're on a bike, right? isn't that what was wanted in the first place?

let's get things straight, shall we?

i build, sell, and fix bikes for a living (at a real bike shop, thank you, not walmart or whatever other place is hip to bash this week). i've yet to put together a kids bike that didn't weigh a ton.

to a kid, a bike is a toy and that's what it should be. if you try to make it anything else they're not going to want to ride it. kids, by nature, are also very abusive to their toys. who in their right mind would pay a couple hundred dollars for what amounts to a toy only to have their kid break it? that's foolish and a waste of money.

in closing, i suppose the point of this post is to ask you to stop trying to hold other people to your own standards and make up your mind. do you want to see more people on bikes? or do you want to see fewer people on bikes that are really expensive?

the two just don't mix.

Hear, hear!

I agree, but why can't we do a little bike bashing? We're mocking the bike itself. I would also say most people on this forum have a "nicer" bike than the $50 one. Plus there needs to be cheap bikes, cause i don't think most people here for their first bike bought anything expensive at all, i know i didn't (when you were younger). Why spend money on something you're not sure you're going to like. It's all in good fun.

Oh, by the way, my bike is STILL a toy and always will be.

I think most people here don't think you have to spend $1500 to buy a beginners bike. They just don't want anyone to waste $80 to $200 on a new department store bike bike that falls apart easily. I know because I went the Huffy route.I actually bent the chainrings shifting gears. I wish I had spent that $100 on a used bike or just saved for something better. Over the 10 years I've been cycling, 8 of them were on a $500 hybrid.

I certainly dont have a problem with people buying cheap bikes. If they want to ride, thats great! I DO have a problem with selection of crap that is available for "cheap". It pisses me off to see the design approach of "Make sure it has some sort of springy full suspension and make it $125". It would be joyous to walk into a dept store one day and instead see a steel bike with no suspension, 7 or so speeds, and thats it for the same price. Keep it simple. Sure it would be heavier than our bikes, not shift as smooth, etc... but it would work, last more than a couple months, and be more FUN because the rider would not be frustrated with the strange noises coming from the energy-sapping parts that are about to fail. I know, this is a crazy concept...

Don't take the attitude of a few to represent all of us.

Before I got into more serious biking, I rode a $15 ten speed I got at a garage sale and my wife rode a GS bike that I went all the way to $25 for. We had a lot of fun on these bikes. But, I wouldn't have wanted to go very far on them (I.e., I straightened the bent chain ring with a crow bar).

While riding today, I saw a young married couple on Magma's. It was pretty obvious that was what they could afford. And, guess what? They were having a lot of fun.

I never paid more than $25 for any bike prior to 4.5 years ago, and then I split for $300 which I thought was tremendously expensive. Now?? We both have road bikes and mtn bikes, and there is over $4,500 of bikes and accesories sitting in my garage as I type.

I think that many folks have to go through a biking evolution, and it would be a crime for someone to put a lot of money into a bike when they did not know whether or not they enjoyed the activity.

So, I, for one, agree with you. However, most of the advice I see in this forum is to encourage folks to use their money wisely - instead of spending $129.99 on a X-Mart bike that won't last, spend $250 on a good used or entry-level one that will.

Personally I didn't care about weight until I could afford a light bike and bought one. A light bike equals a lightened wallet. Up until last year I was riding a $400 close to 30 pound hardtail and loving it. It was what I could afford at the time. It was one model above the bottom of Treks barrel.
If you read the posts here not everyone is buying Litespeeds and Colnago's. A fair percentage of members here are riding lower level bikes. I have yet to see anyone discouraged from riding any bike here. If anything there is substantial encouragement from everyone for any "newbie" to get into riding.

Having not read what other have said this is my take on walmart bikes.

If someone (kid adult, my grandma) comes in here and says I wanna do 4 ft drop and ride dh here is my bike (displays picture of future walmart special) I will tell him/her straight up that the bike while it may work won't last long will be very expensive in the long run and SOMETIMES may be downright dangerous.This is the only time I start knocking those bikes. If they still buy this bike for this purpose they had better not complain because these bikes are seriously not meant for it.

If someone says they are looking for a commuter / soft pack double track bike to travel around with the family, by all means purchase any bike you like.

As for weight, my ht weighs more than most people duallies so I never comment on weight (except with those monroe shock bikes. Those things are tanks wow ).


I honestly think most of us try to take each situation and give the best advice possible with regards to what they want. And it is their right to know that parts tend to break more on cheapy bikes then with better parts. Esepcially since most salesmen in big stores just try to sell the bike and don't understand what is good or not. Personally if I ever have a kid he will ride a BMX as long as possible. Tough, cheap and tough.

Now excuse me while I go irragate this would in my thigh

I know that I, for one, am a member of this faction.

The three topics guaranteed to start a long thread with plenty of highbrow attitudes:

1. Should cyclists wear hemets?
2. Which rides better, steel or aluminum?
3. Are Xmart bikes a good buy?

The answers of course:[list=1][*]Yes, if there's even the SLIGHTEST chance that they'd save a life they're well worth it.[*]Generally a well made quality steel bike is more supple and makes a better long-haul bike than an aluminum bike with minimal weight penalty. Also generally a quality steel bike will outlast an aluminum model. However many people are quite happy with aluminum and that's great. Everyone likes something different. <shrug>[*]You've GOT to be kidding.[/list=1]

Now if you want to start some s*** tell 1oldroadie or D*Alex that brooks saddles suck! *

*I'M KIDDING!!

I'm a newbie. Haven't ridden a bike in over 9 years. Well, now that I live less than 25 miles from work and gas prices are soaring where I live, I decided to buy a bike and commute to work. I also bought it to run errands around town and to get back in shape. I also wanted a new hobby. (Plus there's this little thing called "fun" as well)

Not knowing anything, I started doing a lot of research. First thing off, I cruised many of the bike forums and info sites to see what had changed in the last decade. Good God, was I out of the loop! I also brushed up on the basic lingo and technology.

Then I asked the bike snob at work what was a good bike for a beginner. I listened intently to every word he said. This gave me wonderful insight into what is considered "cutting edge" in the bike world. But I also knew this was far beyond what I needed at the time. And it's really easy to spot a snob of any kind. So instead of falling into that expensive "oneupsmanship" game they play, continued with my research.

Next, I did a total 180 and visited Wal-Mart and took a look at the bikes they had. I hate Wal-Mart with a passion, but sometimes you just can't beat their sales. The bikes didn't look all that bad at first glance, but something just didn't sit well with me. Maybe it was the way they made a grown man wade through a sea of action figures and Barbie dolls to just look at a bicycle that turned me off? I dunno.

Finally, I stopped off at my LBS. The counter guy was VERY helpful and attentive, (slow day + he was probably paid on commision), and showed me every type of bike on God's green earth. Then I told him I just needed an all purpose hybrid for commuting, running errands, etc. That's when he showed me some of last years models they had on sale. he of course tried to steer me towards the most expensive, which I totally took under consideration. I ended up getting a 2002 Fuji Supreme for $160. I also bought about $100 in extras, ( rear rack, trunk bag, lock, junk like that) so as to not make the guy feel too bad.

This all transpired in less than three days. I love my bike! I ride to work every day. I save about $100 in gas a month. And I feel more in shape now as well.

If people just did a little research and went out and made an informed purchase, instead of just rushing out and making an instant gratification purchase, I think more people would be happier with their bikes. Maybe a Wal-Mart bike is all what most people need. Then again, if people just did a little bit of looking around, they could find a better deal for about the same price. I dunno.

Sory for the rant.

This is what I try so hard to get across to people.

Sorry still not swallowing that one.

This thread brings up a couple things Ive noticed also.One,nobody has readily available practical sturdy bikes for the avg Joe for a decent price.Two,nobody makes bikes for guys like me that ride for a living.In my case you have to either buy something close to what you need and modify it or build it up from scratch.Ive got no problem with walmart or ppl that shop there,but given the nature of their customers you'd think they'd sell something a little more appropriate than ds megas and whatnot....I know,marketing has everything to do with it,then again Ive never been to an LBS that stocks what I need either w/o some mods done to it first.If huffy et al can pump out 100-$200 bikes that fall apart,then they can easily sell something that the ppl really need.Like how about a 7-9spd rear, single chainring with an alum mtb frame(rigid fr and back) with braze ons for fenders etc and street tires.Not too much to ask I dont think.Ive also been wondering lately what ever happened to good old dependable singlespeed bikes at dept stores?

As far as weight and the weight weenies go....ya whatever,I ride over 300 miles/wk on a 32lb singlespeed mtb that I set-up for the street that set me back about $450.My other workbike is a fixed gear I built up just for work,weighs about 16.5lbs and cost me about $750.Im not any faster on the lighter bike LOL,and the SS mtb is much more durable and trouble free.Whatever turns your cranks,as long as your riding

Go HERE and browse for a while. I think you'll see what you're looking for.



Heres a Retro 7 that fits the bill pretty closely

Horn, I think your last statement was the point of the whole start to this thread. Who cares what they are riding as long as they are riding.

I have to say that there are surprises out there as well. I was at an LBS and this old bird, maybe a week younger than God was shopping for a bike. He'd been riding the one he had for a while, and was looking for a summer bike. I was impressed. It seemed the LBS dudes were too, as they all talked about the guy while he was on his test ride. Seems he rides everywhere he goes, and uses the LBS for those minor repairs, and tuneups. It gave me faith in my fellow man to hear about a guy this side of sleeping in the dirt still out there riding.

Then the other day I was cruising on the fixed, and came face on with a little old lady on an old three speed. She had a smile a mile wide, the bike had to be one she bought when her kids were riding, and she was out on it with her hat and just a huge smile. While I hope to be them one day, I also commend them for riding at all.

Today I had to laugh at us(bikers et al) cause we are a strange bunch. I was in getting a replacement for my blown Surley hub, and this guy comes in with one of those "chopper bikes" you know really built up with a front wheel about six feet out from the handle bars, with a five speed rear triangle. It was a primo ride! I'd love to do something like that, or the tall bikes. I don't see us knocking those guys as not being purists.

As Cyclists we come in all shapes, sizes and colors. Our tastes vary, some like the simplicity of SS and fixed, others aren't happy unless they have Ti between their legs, with a triple crank, and a 10 speed Dura-Ace 11-21 cassette, oh and don't forget the flight deck, and wireless shifting. Oh and the matching shoes, helmet and jersey.

I work with a population of our society who don't really care what they ride, as long as they can get to and from where they have to be. I've helped these guys put together their found treasures, stuff I wouldn't ride, but I'm more than happy to share with them how and what to do to keep and get their bikes running. And when they discuss with me the bike they want to buy at X-mart with the money they made from riding to their first job in a couple years, I don't shoot them down for looking at those bikes, they are affordable, and are bright and shiney, and we all know what a bright shiny bike does for our self esteem, I hope one day if they stick with riding, and their job, and their recovery they'll eventually get to a place where they'll be swinging a leg over a Carbon Fiber frame, recalling that day they first started out being clean and sober and riding a hunk of junk to a gig cleaning the seats at the metrodome after ball games cause it was all they could get fresh out of the work house, treatment, or the streets.

What I don't understand, is where are all these elitest pigs? I don't think I've actually ever read a thread/post from someone that actually put down another cyclist for what they were riding. I've read "how can you buy a bike at X-mart." To that I say, I don't know, cause I can find bikes for freeor damn close to free, so why buy in the first place? I try not to build myself up with pointing the finger. I am sure folks look at me and wonder why I ride what I ride. Heck I got a compliment the other day from a guy at my LBS, he said I smoked him the other day on my fixie. I didn't even know it.

Okay that's my .02.

Maybe a walmart bike is all we can afford?

Any bike is better than no bike.

We ran a 31km gravel road mtb tour yesterday, out of 30 riders approx 1/3 were riding what would be New Zealand's version of a w/mart bike.
The only rider that had a mechanical failure that caused them to withdraw was riding an expensive mtb purchased from a large reputable LBS.

To that I say, I don't know, cause I can find bikes for free or damn close to free, so why buy in the first place?
Okay that's my .02.[/COLOR] [/B][/QUOTE]

I totally agree that there are some really great bikes out their for free or close to that, so why would anyone buy a bike from a discount store when it is of questionalbe durability.

I like to buy out dated technology and get better quality for less money.

Man - you seem to have a real hangup with those of us a little older and wiser than you.

Who the heck is "them"? Some sort of alien?

And what would you call me at 63?

We have folks participating in this forum in their 70's.

If I've offended someone with a remark towards age, it wasn't my intention. I am nowhere near being a youn twerp, not yet dry behind the ears. I'M IN THE MIDDLE OF MY MID-LIFE CRISIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have nothing but respect and admiration for my fellow bikers whose age rivals my rpm. I hope to be one of them some day, in say 30 years.

Dnvr you ever think about maybe trying decaf?

Don't drink any coffee, nor alcohol for that matter, nor anything with caffeine!! So, you can't blame it on that.

Ageism permeates our society - all the way from my smoking neighbor lady, who thinks we need to be "taken care of" (I could outlast her at any physical activity) to my wife being turned down for jobs because "she should be retired," to "senior fitness programs" where folks are told to lift no more than a 20 pound weight (WOW!!).

Ive seen those..er been too that site,almost bought one 2 yrs ago,prob should have,now can we get walmart to sell them?It would make more sense that the DS mega things they sell

I think Madwagon has a good thing going on....they look from their specs that theyd prob be just fine for the avg joe looking for basic transportation.

Naisme,

I doubt you will see a post from my an elitist pig about this subject....but a few may read this thread and chuckle Im sure.

There's a little bit of snob in me,I will admit it...it just runs in reverse LOL,I sometimes chuckle when I see someone on a megabuck race bike and 30lbs of beer belly hanging over the toptube......but its cool,theyre riding and will some effort someday they may be a lean mean riding machine,it happens.