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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Addiction 2023.4

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Old 12-22-23, 10:29 AM
  #9201  
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Originally Posted by TMonk
That's it, plain and simple. There is also some difficulty in calculating FTP. For example I burn hot, so I think the traditional 5' then 1x20' overestimates my FTP. So the more time in zone, the more I will suffer relative to some other riders.
Yes, same here. My personal protocol was at one point a 2x20 @ max, but then take 95% of the lower of the two. The 8-minute protocol would have absurdly over-estimated m.
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Old 12-22-23, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
In my case, it's not so much TTE as it is TTNLGAF.
Effort is always context dependent.
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Old 12-22-23, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by LAJ
Basically, off season a fine line between both endurance and strength. If I understand the question, as the season neared, weights were nearly off the table. The super heavy was also off the table like a month before the season started.. I backed down to 2x20 body weight-ish, then 1x20 1.25-ish on squats, and 1x10 deads. Lunges, the weights were gone.
I meant within a given day. Some say don't do it, some say three hours, some say six...
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Old 12-22-23, 10:41 AM
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Thanks Mr Monk and Bah, on the replies which seem reasonable. I've started to come to the conclusion that the short test also over-estimates my FTP. Reflecting, part of the reason is that I've "tested" the day after pure off-days, but then use the values in setting goals for rides after non-offdays.
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Old 12-22-23, 10:42 AM
  #9205  
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Originally Posted by MoAlpha
I meant within a given day. Some say don't do it, some say three hours, some say six...

Ahh. I would lift at 4 am. Do the workout after work. Saturday, I would sleep in a bit, so minimum 3 hours between lifting and the bike, but I would do all I could to lengthen that time in-between. .
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Old 12-22-23, 10:45 AM
  #9206  
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Originally Posted by MoAlpha
Effort is always context dependent.
"I was running as fast as I could."

"If someone pointed a kitten at you could you have run faster?"

"Well yeah."

"Then no you weren't."
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Old 12-22-23, 10:47 AM
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In search of bar height I just put an order in for a Whisky No7 fork for my road bike.

More expensive than a riser stem, but infinitely less ugly.

Much cheaper than a whole new bike though. Fingers crossed it helps.
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Old 12-22-23, 10:54 AM
  #9208  
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Originally Posted by Mojo31
My bad. More of a murse.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:01 AM
  #9209  
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Originally Posted by abshipp
In search of bar height I just put an order in for a Whisky No7 fork for my road bike.

More expensive than a riser stem, but infinitely less ugly.

Much cheaper than a whole new bike though. Fingers crossed it helps.
+5 or +7 stem that much of a turn off ?
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Old 12-22-23, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Mojo31
Just think of the first one you see as his first.
agree - good thought

and maybe if he is there for his first hit in T ball all will be forgotten
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Old 12-22-23, 11:07 AM
  #9211  
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Originally Posted by t2p
+5 or +7 stem that much of a turn off ?
It really is IMO.

Top tube slope is 8*, I’ve mocked it up with a +7 and it’s quite jarring.

If it doesn’t give me everything I want on my current frame, well, then I’ll have a carbon fork to build a bike around

Last edited by abshipp; 12-22-23 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:11 AM
  #9212  
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Originally Posted by big john
I really should do some upper body work. I'm starting to look like this. The arms, not the gut.


but still better than this
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Old 12-22-23, 11:12 AM
  #9213  
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Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets
They need to make a concentrate, so you can just do a couple shots and be ready to go. Chugging damn near half litre is just too much!
They've seem to have come a long way. This favor wasn't so bad.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:13 AM
  #9214  
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That was a cold ride. It started out cold and never really got warm. It was overcast so lack of sun contributed to the cold.

I think I may want to look into a pair of merino wool cycling socks for subfreezing days like today. Any suggestions? Must not be itchy.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:14 AM
  #9215  
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Originally Posted by abshipp
It really is. Top tube slope is 8*, I’ve mocked it up with a +7 and it’s quite jarring.
guess I have more of an off road / MTB mentality so it does not bother me … in fact on the current / newer bikes I approve … but vintage bikes still like the -17 or whatever … Cinelli XA … although I did have zero degree stems on a few 90’s road bikes

Last edited by t2p; 12-22-23 at 11:19 AM.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:14 AM
  #9216  
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Originally Posted by datlas
That was a cold ride. It started out cold and never really got warm. It was overcast so lack of sun contributed to the cold.

I think I may want to look into a pair of merino wool cycling socks for subfreezing days like today. Any suggestions? Must not be itchy.
lightweight shoe covers ?
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Old 12-22-23, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Bah Humbug
So a recent post was just saying TTE could be 40-75 minutes at FTP. Technically, if we get super-nerdy, FTP is not defined as "one hour" but "lactate threshold power" which is usually roughly an hour but to be perfectly tested requires blood lactate testing during the test.

Also, there is the whole indoor-outdoor thing. Cooling and fresh air are much bigger limiters indoors, so even a test that results in an accurate FTP for your body can result in a number that's unsustainable for an hour indoors in an other-than-perfect training room. And it was never possible for me to find a suitable venue that would allow a true 60-minute test outdoors. Even 20 minutes wasn't doable. I was able to do my FTP tests at 2x20' @ 105% of target, yes. However, the 2x20' @ 100% would leave me shredded for the rest of the week, as would the test of course. The trainer in general seemed to beat up my muscles much worse than outdoors.
This all day. I can hold 105-110% of my TrainerRoad tested FTP on climbs around here for close to 40 minutes. But I have a really hard time holding 90-95% longer than 15 minutes on the trainer.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by t2p
guess I have more of an off road / MTB mentality so it does not bother me … in fact on the current / newer bikes I approve … but vintage bikes still like the -17 or whatever … Cinelli XA … although I did have zero degree stems on a few 90’s bikes
With the new fork I’ll be able to add 20mm of bar height, so not like I’m looking for a few inches.

Currently have 20mm spacers plus 10mm headset cover. Whisky permits up to 50mm from base of stem to upper headset bearing.

Fork is black and a tower of silver parts will probably be a bit too much so I’ll probably go back to an all black cockpit.



Maybe I’m a bit odd, but if I don’t like how my bike looks I won’t ride it.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:26 AM
  #9219  
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Originally Posted by abshipp
With the new fork I’ll be able to add 20mm of bar height, so not like I’m looking for a few inches.

Currently have 20mm spacers plus 10mm headset cover. Whisky permits up to 50mm from base of stem to upper headset bearing.

Fork is black and a tower of silver parts will probably be a bit too much so I’ll probably go back to an all black cockpit.



Maybe I’m a bit odd, but if I don’t like how my bike looks I won’t ride it.
ohhhh … that bike … that’s a sweet bike … I’d prob have the fork painted to match the frame - but that’s just me

regardless - silver or black cockpit will look good (with current silver seat post or a black seat post)
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Old 12-22-23, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by abshipp
With the new fork I’ll be able to add 20mm of bar height, so not like I’m looking for a few inches.

Currently have 20mm spacers plus 10mm headset cover. Whisky permits up to 50mm from base of stem to upper headset bearing.

Fork is black and a tower of silver parts will probably be a bit too much so I’ll probably go back to an all black cockpit.



Maybe I’m a bit odd, but if I don’t like how my bike looks I won’t ride it.
Hows that odd? Gotta have style!
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Old 12-22-23, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Bah Humbug
"I was running as fast as I could."

"If someone pointed a kitten at you could you have run faster?"

"Well yeah."

"Then no you weren't."
Exactly.

I have a new postdoc who's interested in pain and fatigue and we are starting a functional brain imaging study to test the hypothesis that the unpleasantness of effort (a hard hand grip) is processed by the same network which processes the unpleasantness of pain. That's a general purpose system which seems to assign value to every thing in the environment and determine what animals and people are willing to do to get or avoid them. The system is constantly informed and updated by things like hunger or fullness, fear, etc. We are also designing a follow-up trial where we'll stimulate a node in that network with transcranial magnetic stimulation and see if we can modulate peoples' perception of effort as unpleasant and maybe get them to work harder. Could have implications for pain disorders, chronic fatigue syndrome etc., and maybe athletes.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by t2p
ohhhh … that bike … that’s a sweet bike … I’d prob have the fork painted to match the frame - but that’s just me

regardless - silver or black cockpit will look good (with current silver seat post or a black seat post)
There is a painter here who I’d trust to get the paint match right. He does lots of carbon repair and his stuff always looks great.

My buddy gave me the idea for a different fork, this bike on Pedalroom gave me the reassurance that it won’t look totally weird:

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Old 12-22-23, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by datlas
That was a cold ride. It started out cold and never really got warm. It was overcast so lack of sun contributed to the cold.

I think I may want to look into a pair of merino wool cycling socks for subfreezing days like today. Any suggestions? Must not be itchy.
Smartwool makes every weight, height, etc. I wear wool socks summer and winter and I've never had an itchy pair.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:37 AM
  #9224  
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Originally Posted by MoAlpha
Abnormal. Next...
Unlike DougRNS's gall bladder, it's impractical to shed my knee, as tempting as that seems right now.
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People here don't get it.
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Old 12-22-23, 11:46 AM
  #9225  
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Originally Posted by datlas
That was a cold ride. It started out cold and never really got warm. It was overcast so lack of sun contributed to the cold.

I think I may want to look into a pair of merino wool cycling socks for subfreezing days like today. Any suggestions? Must not be itchy.
I do not have itch problems with my Pearl Izumi Merino wool socks. BUT you could wear them over a pair of thin summer cycling socks.
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Last edited by genejockey; 12-22-23 at 11:53 AM.
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