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Where is the Weight Difference coming from?

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Where is the Weight Difference coming from?

Old 11-12-23, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Remind us all again why 1 kg of weight matters for non-pro riders?
Because some of us non-pro riders are skinny climbers, power-to-weight ratio is everything to climbers, and the denominator in the power-to-weight measure is weight.

For me, dropping 1 kg means a 1.5% power-to-weight increase.
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Old 11-12-23, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Because some of us non-pro riders are skinny climbers, power-to-weight ratio is everything to climbers, and the denominator in the power-to-weight measure is weight.

For me, dropping 1 kg means a 1.5% power-to-weight increase.
I get that if you are climbing competitively, where 1.5% might actually matter.
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Old 11-12-23, 08:17 PM
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The weight difference is due to the lighting system Cannondale installs on their bikes from the factory. Canyon doesn't have a battery, front light, and taillight.

/thread
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Old 11-13-23, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by frdfandc
The weight difference is due to the lighting system Cannondale installs on their bikes from the factory. Canyon doesn't have a battery, front light, and taillight.

/thread
This.

https://www.bikeradar.com/reviews/bi...-8-di2-review/

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Old 11-13-23, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Because some of us non-pro riders are skinny climbers, power-to-weight ratio is everything to climbers, and the denominator in the power-to-weight measure is weight.

For me, dropping 1 kg means a 1.5% power-to-weight increase.
Numerator challenged cyclists are often weight weenies....
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Old 11-13-23, 09:36 AM
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Yeah, the light system has got to be a part of it. You did link though 2 different bikes than what I was looking at (Synapse Carbon 2 RLE) and Endurace (not Ultimate).
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Old 11-13-23, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by wheelreason
Numerator challenged cyclists are often weight weenies....
On the other hand, demoninator enhanced cyclists see essentially no benefit from weight savings.
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Old 11-13-23, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
I get that if you are climbing competitively, where 1.5% might actually matter.
An extra 1.5% would have been helpful on Saturday morning with a group of friends on a ride that included a lot of long, steady climbs (5000+' over 2+ hours). I could not quite maintain the pace of the rest of the guys and slowly got dropped between each of our re-group points.
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Old 11-13-23, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene
Looking at, for the same price, 2 bikes.
Cannondale Synapse https://www.cannondale.com/en-us/bik...e-carbon-2-rle
vs
Canyon SLX8 https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road-bi...aero/2740.html

While I know weight doesn't really matter, considering the actual percentage when adding our own body weights, I'm still curious why there's a listed difference of 2.6 lbs between these 2 bikes (19.7 lbs for the Cannondale, 17.1 lbs for the Canyon). I know there are a couple bits that are CF on the Canyon, that aren't on the CDale, but eg. an alloy handlebar isn't going to weigh that much more than a CF one, is it? Trying to determine, if I want to get a locally available bike, would there be somewhat easily done changes that would drop weight on the CDale? Or is it likely the weights are not correctly represented on one or both makers' websites?
That version of the Synapse (RLE) has all that built in battery/light crap but the wheels also play a big role
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Old 11-13-23, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
An extra 1.5% would have been helpful on Saturday morning with a group of friends on a ride that included a lot of long, steady climbs (5000+' over 2+ hours). I could not quite maintain the pace of the rest of the guys and slowly got dropped between each of our re-group points.
Sure. If you were climbing at a steady 2W/kg then 1 kg off the bike would save you 2W of power. Better than nothing, but not a huge amount. I agree it might make or break you in a marginal situation.

If climbing is the only thing that matters to you then a lightweight bike is an obvious advantage. But if climbing is only one thing that matters to you then there are many other factors to consider besides bike weight. (Aero, comfort, fit, handling, stiffness, braking, gearing, durability).

Last edited by PeteHski; 11-13-23 at 11:46 AM.
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Old 11-13-23, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Sure. If you were climbing at a steady 2W/kg then 1 kg off the bike would save you 2W of power. Better than nothing, but not a huge amount. I agree it might make or break you in a marginal situation.

If climbing is the only thing that matters to you then a lightweight bike is an obvious advantage. But if climbing is only one thing that matters to you then there are many other factors to consider besides bike weight. (Aero, comfort, fit, handling, stiffness, braking, gearing, durability).
A light bike is way easier to load onto a car rack, or hang on a wall rack. Also, when your buddy picks up your light bike at the group ride coffee stop, he will say, "Wow. Your bike is light." Those are bonus points.
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Old 11-13-23, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
I could not quite maintain the pace of the rest of the guys and slowly got dropped between each of our re-group points.
Story of my life.
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Old 11-13-23, 12:36 PM
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Talking about weight:

Then you could add the weight of 2 large filled water bottles for hill climbs. Depending on the size and material of the bottles, two large filled ones can add up to 2 additional kilograms. Maybe the serious hill climbers either delete the bottles completely or only carry a small bottle partially filled. But on hot days with long climbs one just can’t get around the weight penalty.
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Old 11-13-23, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
A light bike is way easier to load onto a car rack, or hang on a wall rack. Also, when your buddy picks up your light bike at the group ride coffee stop, he will say, "Wow. Your bike is light." Those are bonus points.
Yeah, but I need the strength training
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Old 11-13-23, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Talking about weight:

Then you could add the weight of 2 large filled water bottles for hill climbs. Depending on the size and material of the bottles, two large filled ones can add up to 2 additional kilograms. Maybe the serious hill climbers either delete the bottles completely or only carry a small bottle partially filled. But on hot days with long climbs one just canít get around the weight penalty.
I could do without bottles completely on most climbs, because I can't drink while panting. But then when I get to the top I'd really miss them, and I don't have a team car or domestiques to bring them to me. I could try drinking one bottle before the base of the climb, so I'm climbing with only one full bottle, but the total system weight would be the same.
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Old 11-13-23, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Talking about weight:

Then you could add the weight of 2 large filled water bottles for hill climbs. Depending on the size and material of the bottles, two large filled ones can add up to 2 additional kilograms. Maybe the serious hill climbers either delete the bottles completely or only carry a small bottle partially filled. But on hot days with long climbs one just canít get around the weight penalty.
I routinely carry 2L of water on big alpine climbs. Last trip I was 78 kg dressed, bike with pedals and bottle cages etc was 8 kg, 2x1L full bottles another 2 kg. So around 88 kg total.

Iím sure I would have totally smashed it on a 7 kg bike!
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Old 11-13-23, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
I routinely carry 2L of water on big alpine climbs. Last trip I was 78 kg dressed, bike with pedals and bottle cages etc was 8 kg, 2x1L full bottles another 2 kg. So around 88 kg total.

Iím sure I would have totally smashed it on a 7 kg bike!
Well...duh.
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Old 11-13-23, 01:44 PM
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These people who say, "You weigh 200 lbs! Another kilo on the bike is < 1% of total system weight!" have it all wrong! It is BECAUSE I weigh 200# that I NEED the lighter bike!!!
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Old 11-13-23, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
These people who say, "You weigh 200 lbs! Another kilo on the bike is < 1% of total system weight!" have it all wrong! It is BECAUSE I weigh 200# that I NEED the lighter bike!!!
There is some truth in that. If I'm climbing with a bunch of lightweights, I am at my limits just trying to avoid losing too much ground. Adding weight to my total would slow me even more. Adding weight to one of the lightweights might slow them a bit, or make them work a little harder, but still not make them slow to my speed.
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Old 11-13-23, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by big john
There is some truth in that. If I'm climbing with a bunch of lightweights, I am at my limits just trying to avoid losing too much ground. Adding weight to my total would slow me even more. Adding weight to one of the lightweights might slow them a bit, or make them work a little harder, but still not make them slow to my speed.
You're not thinking big enough! "Hey, I need to get these 2 25# bags of cat litter home after the ride, and I hurt my back this weekend. Could you carry them for me?" I bet it would slow any of them right down to your speed!
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Old 11-13-23, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
You're not thinking big enough! "Hey, I need to get these 2 25# bags of cat litter home after the ride, and I hurt my back this weekend. Could you carry them for me?" I bet it would slow any of them right down to your speed!
It might be easier to get them to push me for a while.
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Old 11-13-23, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by big john
It might be easier to get them to push me for a while.
Offer to let them draft you on the downhill - "You push me, I'll pull you!"
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Old 11-13-23, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Offer to let them draft you on the downhill - "You push me, I'll pull you!"
lol, they do that anyway. Reminds me of a day some years ago when I offered to show a couple racer friends a mountain route they had never done. I was having a really bad day and one of them did push me on some of the climbing. I was highly embarrassed. Of course, he still brings it up from time to time.
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Old 11-13-23, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by big john
lol, they do that anyway. Reminds me of a day some years ago when I offered to show a couple racer friends a mountain route they had never done. I was having a really bad day and one of them did push me on some of the climbing. I was highly embarrassed. Of course, he still brings it up from time to time.
Years ago, I did a ride with another member of PenVelo, a smallish woman who was also fairly lightly built. I'd been pulling for a while, so when we made the next turn, she decided to be polite and took over. Thing is, the road is an arrow-straight 1-2% descent. After about 100 yards of her pedaling like mad and me braking constantly to prevent coasting into her rear wheel, I said, "Here, let me". I can get up to 30 mph with almost no effort there, and she was struggling to reach 25.
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Old 11-13-23, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
A light bike is way easier to load onto a car rack, or hang on a wall rack. Also, when your buddy picks up your light bike at the group ride coffee stop, he will say, "Wow. Your bike is light." Those are bonus points.
100% true. I have good buddies one of which has a Cervelo S3 that is like 15lbs and the other a Specialized S Work that is around 17 lbs and oh man do those feel good when I load them in my truck. you would not think 2-4 lbs would make a difference but mine feels like they are made of lead compared to those two bikes.
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