Immersive waxing / it should be more popular
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#452
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You anti-waxxers don't know what you are talking about. In the last 1200 miles, I have been lazy after putting a newly waxed chain on. I have applies liquid wax (Silca or Squirt) three times. Then, I removed the chain, turned the crockpot on, threw the chain in for an hour, removed and installed. I cannot imagine an easier (effective) chain regime, If you think wiping a chain down with a cloth helps, there is no helping you.
#453
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Shaking up chains with solvents is eye opening. I've done a few chains now for my household and friends.
I found that dry drip lube chains require multiple flushes until the solvent out clean, whereas even well used Squirt treated chains often run clear on the second flush already. This suggests that the 'gunk' with Squirt travels out of the chain mainly and does not carry contamination inside as much when compared to oil-based lubes. Wet and greasy lubes are a shocker.
But regardless, there are always all sorts of particles coming out, even from chains that have been frequently cleaned with chain cleaning and degreaser contraptions, suggesting those also don't flush out well and are more of an external rinse and brush.
People who wipe their chain to be shiny on the outside will definitely not get anywhere near resetting contamination. But we've seen in this thread that this is happily ignored because the bike still runs.
I found that dry drip lube chains require multiple flushes until the solvent out clean, whereas even well used Squirt treated chains often run clear on the second flush already. This suggests that the 'gunk' with Squirt travels out of the chain mainly and does not carry contamination inside as much when compared to oil-based lubes. Wet and greasy lubes are a shocker.
But regardless, there are always all sorts of particles coming out, even from chains that have been frequently cleaned with chain cleaning and degreaser contraptions, suggesting those also don't flush out well and are more of an external rinse and brush.
People who wipe their chain to be shiny on the outside will definitely not get anywhere near resetting contamination. But we've seen in this thread that this is happily ignored because the bike still runs.
#454
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I found that dry drip lube chains require multiple flushes until the solvent out clean, whereas even well used Squirt treated chains often run clear on the second flush already. This suggests that the 'gunk' with Squirt travels out of the chain mainly and does not carry contamination inside as much when compared to oil-based lubes. Wet and greasy lubes are a shocker.
Some even claim that they can wipe their chains so clean that further wiping does not leave any stains on a rag. When I used drip lube I could never get to that level of cleanliness, even if I tried to wipe and lube right after a ride.
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Yes! You nailed it. I am fully aware that wiping off the outside of my chain will do nothing to clean the grit and grease that has worked its way between the plates and around the pins. And I happily ignore this fact because, well, you said it. My drivetrain works just fine, and chains last me thousands of miles. I will not challenge the claim that waxed chains stay cleaner. I'll even stop questioning whether waxing truly is quick and easy for some people. For me, it is more trouble than it's worth, given the fact that drip lube has always been "good enough" for me.
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Are we supposed to be waxing our cassette, chainrings and jockey wheels as well?
#457
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Shaking up chains with solvents is eye opening. I've done a few chains now for my household and friends.
I found that dry drip lube chains require multiple flushes until the solvent out clean, whereas even well used Squirt treated chains often run clear on the second flush already. This suggests that the 'gunk' with Squirt travels out of the chain mainly and does not carry contamination inside as much when compared to oil-based lubes. Wet and greasy lubes are a shocker.
But regardless, there are always all sorts of particles coming out, even from chains that have been frequently cleaned with chain cleaning and degreaser contraptions, suggesting those also don't flush out well and are more of an external rinse and brush.
People who wipe their chain to be shiny on the outside will definitely not get anywhere near resetting contamination. But we've seen in this thread that this is happily ignored because the bike still runs.
I found that dry drip lube chains require multiple flushes until the solvent out clean, whereas even well used Squirt treated chains often run clear on the second flush already. This suggests that the 'gunk' with Squirt travels out of the chain mainly and does not carry contamination inside as much when compared to oil-based lubes. Wet and greasy lubes are a shocker.
But regardless, there are always all sorts of particles coming out, even from chains that have been frequently cleaned with chain cleaning and degreaser contraptions, suggesting those also don't flush out well and are more of an external rinse and brush.
People who wipe their chain to be shiny on the outside will definitely not get anywhere near resetting contamination. But we've seen in this thread that this is happily ignored because the bike still runs.
#459
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Enquiring weenie minds want to know...
How much does all this wax weigh?
How much does all this wax weigh?
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I pour molten wax into the frame via the seat tube .... so my internally routed cables can get the lubrication they need.
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#463
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#464
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I expect that I fit this description. I use wet lube and accept that my chain is never "factory clean" but honestly I get 5000 miles before the chain wears to 0.5% (and that's when I replace them), and my cassettes last 15000 miles, chainrings last 40000 miles, so the "marginal gain" in this case is way too marginal IMO. Of course, YMMV.
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Amazon.com : DuPont Non-Stick Dry-Film Lubricant Aerosol, 10 oz : Power Tool Lubricants : Sports & Outdoors
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TBH its kinda fun. It feels like "arts and crafts time". I'm too lazy to be as dedicated with the new and inter-wax cleaning as some people. Turn on the pot, dip, dry and go.
I think a lot of it is my obsessiveness with having things neat and tidy. I hate a mess. This extends to my household as well and causes my wife fair bits of pleasure and pain
I think a lot of it is my obsessiveness with having things neat and tidy. I hate a mess. This extends to my household as well and causes my wife fair bits of pleasure and pain
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Having said that I did just try the whole molten speed wax mineral spirits/alcohol dip with a new chain, since I'm building up a new bike. Kinda wanted to go a little extra and have everything super spiffy. We'll see if this lasts, it was a bit more work. Before, I would simply soak a new chain overnight in ~50% degreaser concentrate.
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went on first ride with wax
The short ride was on flat tarmac and so far, I'm impressed. Runs clean and quiet. Don't know if it is loader than my go to Finish Line Dry, but its close enough that I can't tell.
Shifting works great.
So far so good
Shifting works great.
So far so good
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#471
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In terms of noise, it may get a bit louder once the initial extra wax has flaked off the chain but it's not the same as a dry chain noise, depends a bit on the bike too. My chains start out dead silent and then at some stage are fully broken in and chatter a bit at certain chain angles. If you want to silence the drivetrain more, then double dipping the chain (swish, hang up for a couple of minutes, then briefly swish again before final drying) gets a bit more wax on it which will keep it silent for far longer and deposit a bit on the rest of the drivetrain as a buffer over time. I heard that topping up with Silca Super Secret for example once the waxed chain has run in a bit will keep it quiet also, but I can't be bothered with a drip on regime and just swap my chains over frequently.
Whilst I experimented with generous coating, I now swish my chains with the wax quite hot and pull them out while the wax has low viscosity for minimal external build up as that is easier to handle/install and produces far less flakes. With that thin coating, the wax bond breaks easily by hand and it does not need to be back-pedalled to push out all sorts of wax plugs between the rollers. The downside is that the chain overall is a bit more naked and runs louder than when it is caked in wax, but there appears to be no difference in friction where it actually matters.
Enjoy the gunk free bike!
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#472
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Having said that I did just try the whole molten speed wax mineral spirits/alcohol dip with a new chain, since I'm building up a new bike. Kinda wanted to go a little extra and have everything super spiffy. We'll see if this lasts, it was a bit more work. Before, I would simply soak a new chain overnight in ~50% degreaser concentrate.
It's going to be a long time before I have to go down that path again but this is the method I would use next time:
- 10-20 minutes initial soak in mineral turps (aka white spirits in the US), then shake and pour out
- Then add new mineral turps and shake it up in a sealed container, for as many times as needed to make it run perfectly clear
- Flush it with boiling water to get most of the solvents off
- Final isopropyl alcohol shake up and then hang to evaporate completely (or finish it with a hair dryer, if impatient)
There's no mistaking the bone dry feeling after the alcohol flies away.
There was this one time when I asked a bike shop to fully strip a new chain and despite the ultrasonic and soaking it in degreaser (granted, bio degreaser, probably not the strongest stuff) it was still tacky to the touch on the outside, so when I shook it up in solvents at home it still got all cloudy. Better to be thorough and have it absolutely stripped so the wax can adhere and work to its full effect.
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Whilst I experimented with generous coating, I now swish my chains with the wax quite hot and pull them out while the wax has low viscosity for minimal external build up as that is easier to handle/install and produces far less flakes. With that thin coating, the wax bond breaks easily by hand and it does not need to be back-pedalled to push out all sorts of wax plugs between the rollers. The downside is that the chain overall is a bit more naked and runs louder than when it is caked in wax, but there appears to be no difference in friction where it actually matters.
Enjoy the gunk free bike!
Enjoy the gunk free bike!
I pull the chain out when hot as well and wipe off the outer excess. I agree it is much less of a hassle than waiting for it to cool and poking the wax out from between the links. When the wax is fully liquid I think it still stays where it needs to due to the metal on metal surface tension.
Went on another ride today and am impressed. Might be a wee bit noisier but nothing bothersome
One thing I did when the wax was liquid was swish a magnet to collect all the steel shavings and pull it out. Was interesting how much came off and how much cleaner the wax became.
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#474
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Yeah, I just used Gulf Wax meant for jarring that I got at the hardware store. As long as it is food grade I think the mineral oil content will be low and controlled and should work well for chains.
I pull the chain out when hot as well and wipe off the outer excess. I agree it is much less of a hassle than waiting for it to cool and poking the wax out from between the links. When the wax is fully liquid I think it still stays where it needs to due to the metal on metal surface tension.
Went on another ride today and am impressed. Might be a wee bit noisier but nothing bothersome
One thing I did when the wax was liquid was swish a magnet to collect all the steel shavings and pull it out. Was interesting how much came off and how much cleaner the wax became.
I pull the chain out when hot as well and wipe off the outer excess. I agree it is much less of a hassle than waiting for it to cool and poking the wax out from between the links. When the wax is fully liquid I think it still stays where it needs to due to the metal on metal surface tension.
Went on another ride today and am impressed. Might be a wee bit noisier but nothing bothersome
One thing I did when the wax was liquid was swish a magnet to collect all the steel shavings and pull it out. Was interesting how much came off and how much cleaner the wax became.
Interesting with the magnet, do you think these are mainly chainring shavings that get flushed out? I'll give that a go as I think the molybdenum in the MSW is not going to stick to the magnet, so that could be a great periodic step to remove shavings from the wax!
#475
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Yeah, I just used Gulf Wax meant for jarring that I got at the hardware store. As long as it is food grade I think the mineral oil content will be low and controlled and should work well for chains.
I pull the chain out when hot as well and wipe off the outer excess. I agree it is much less of a hassle than waiting for it to cool and poking the wax out from between the links. When the wax is fully liquid I think it still stays where it needs to due to the metal on metal surface tension.
Went on another ride today and am impressed. Might be a wee bit noisier but nothing bothersome
One thing I did when the wax was liquid was swish a magnet to collect all the steel shavings and pull it out. Was interesting how much came off and how much cleaner the wax became.
I pull the chain out when hot as well and wipe off the outer excess. I agree it is much less of a hassle than waiting for it to cool and poking the wax out from between the links. When the wax is fully liquid I think it still stays where it needs to due to the metal on metal surface tension.
Went on another ride today and am impressed. Might be a wee bit noisier but nothing bothersome
One thing I did when the wax was liquid was swish a magnet to collect all the steel shavings and pull it out. Was interesting how much came off and how much cleaner the wax became.