67tony 

^This ^

I've only done a couple dozen vintage bikes, and only two freewheels, but that's been my usual experience, too.

Oiling through a port requires removing cogs.
Oozing oil through a tight seam seems tedius.
Pus, as pointed out above...the oil runs out eventually.

I used Phil's green, because that's what I have. Quiet as a mouse, and long-lasting.
If I have to do any more, I'll buy some NGLI 1 grease.

I like the idea of it never needing another service...by me, anyway!

Cycle Tourist

If you don't mind the extra friction, grease is long lasting and quiet. I prefer oil and dripping through the seam while spinning. Adding a little oil after a long tour or every season along with routine maintenance is pretty easy. As already mentioned there is very little stress on the bearings and unless you are going for zero maintenance I'd go for oil.

pastorbobnlnh 

Sorry I'm a bit late to this discussion. I'm on sabbatical and part of my discipline is to ride more and surf the internet less.

IMO, "Flush & Drizzle" is only a stop gap until a proper service can be completed. Unless the freewheel is opened up, bad bearings, broken pawls, and corrosion cannot be seen nor corrected.

All new freewheels come with grease, not oil. In NOS vintage freewheels, the grease has usually evaporated. Depending on where the freewheel has lived, there can be internal corrosion on the bearings and surfaces. In 1990s Sachs Aris freewheels the grease normally turns into a very sticky "peanut butter" which can cause the pawls to stick close. The red plastic seals/bearing cages basically preclude "Flush & Drizzle" unless the sprockets are removed to access the port. However, let me caution I've seen old Sachs grease so caked into the pawl sockets that I had to dig it out with a tool even after a long soak in solvent and cleaning in an ultrasonic cleaner.

My preference is to use synthetic grease which is very temperature, moisture, and salt resistant. Those three properties work well together to keep contaminants from reaching the bearings, pawls and spring(s).

My rule of thumb is to only use enough grease in the race to hold the bearings in place. I place a drop of oil on each pawl pivot and I wipe the ratchet teeth with the same oil. Grease is a no-no in the teeth or on the pawls.

The friction from new grease is normal and does not impact performance and usually dissipates after a few hundred miles of use. YMMV.

Just my two cents. Happy social distancing riding!

Velo Mule

I just rebuilt my SunTour Perfect last night. I also like to use grease on the bearings. I used SuperLube. I've used other greases on past rebuilds. I have to qualify that I am not an expert. I am a pure amateur. But I do like my vintage freewheels, I am also thrifty, so I will spend the time to rebuild them. It is satisfying when they are back together again.

I, like Pastor Bob, put just enough grease to retain the ball in the races. But I also put a tiny dab on the pawl and use my finger to smear it around the ramp circumference. I also like the freewheel to be relatively quiet.

I noticed when I opened up the SunTour block last night that there was a dab of grease on and around the pawl.

I have a Shimano 5 speed that I am on the fence about rebuilding. I did the Flush and Dribble and the fluid coming out looked brown like rust. It is working and as many of you point out, even if it was bad, it only would be a factor when coasting. A SunRace 6 speed is less than $10, so it is tempting.

The other factor is that I would like to get the cogs off of the Shimano, but it has the little lockring and I don;t know how to remove that.

67tony 

Here is the answer, thanks to John Thompson:

...removing the cogs is a good deal easier than completely rebuilding the freewheel. All you need is a freewheel vise and a chain whip. Or, if you want to service it on the wheel, just two chain whips. One to hold the freewheel steady and the other to unthread the smallest cog so you can slide the splined cogs off the body and expose the oil port.

Salamandrine 

Yes, I know that I've said that "flush and drizzle" was the standard bike shop way of freewheel maintenance BITD. Back to that shortly.

For here and now, I agree with Pastor Bob. Freewheels now have typically been sitting around 35+ years. The grease has turned to varnish and extra dry parmesan by now. It's not like you can go to your local bike shop and buy a Regina Oro or Suntour New Winner anymore for $20 or whatever. Let's conserve what it still out there. They are basically antiques now. Take 'em apart, clean and repack.

Back to BITD. As I said, shops flushed and drizzled because paying for an overhaul would cost more than a new freewheel. Freewheels then would have been fairly new yet, and a good flush was effective. Insides take a while to turn to cheese. Especially since back then Safety Kleen tanks were full of Stoddard solvent, not soapy water.

I usually only flushed and drizzled my personal freewheels BITD. I only had one good bike and I raced and rode a ton of miles. I burned through 2-3 freewheels a year, maybe more. I'm talking wearing out the teeth, not breaking them or whatever. This wasn't unusual. So it didn't make that much sense to do much more than flush and drizzle if the freewheel was going to be tossed in a couple months anyway.

Nowadays of course it's different. Most people on this forum have a few bikes, and many probably don't get ridden that often. Me, I no longer have the time or inclination to ride 400m/wk. Makes more sense to baby the remaining Oros and Ultras and what not still out there. They ain't going to make any more anytime soon.

That said, I don't think grease is necessary for the internal ball bearings of a freewheel. No significant load. Oil is fine. However, grease sure holds those little balls in place better than oil if/when you are repacking...

Velo Mule

On most freewheels I don't have a problems of using chainwhips to remove the outer cogs. But I am not sure how to remove the cogs on the Shimano as shown below because it seems to have this lock ring that looks like it needs a special tool.


Is there a special tool. Do I hit it with a small drift? Does anyone know?

curbtender

Reverse threaded.Try a spanner first. I've used FinishLine teflon.

Cougrrcj

Back 40years ago, I used marine Outboard Lower lubricant in my freewheels. Thicker than 80W oil, but thinner than automotive axle grease or even white lithium grease, and supposedly water-resistant so it wouldn't wash out. That was the theory anyway... For the past ten years or so, it has been white lithium grease since my supply of Outboard Lower oil was depleted...

Prowler 

Calling Pastorbobnlnh again as he once told me he had such a tool. AFAIK not reverse threaded. The ring inside that locknut - top bearing cap/inner race - is probably reverse threaded. I've not found a 'spanner' or lock ring tool that will work. The notches are too shallow. Nor a 'channellock'/slip joint plier that will work either. Too thin a ring.

Bob, glad you and yours are well and can you post a photo of the tool, please? Probably unobtainable but we gotten curious minds out here. And I have lots of wood and aluminum so I could make one, eh?

jethin

I recently rebuilt a freewheel with lots of grease. It rumbles a bit now (races perhaps) and doesn’t spin great. I guess grease might not be ideal but I’m not worried about it. It seems like you’d want something longer lasting than oil on there, and I assume it will loosen up with use. Anyway I hope to try it out soon.

pastorbobnlnh 

Prowler thanks for the mention.

A few years ago I found someone in Britain who custom made the tool to remove the Shimano lockring for the above pictured freewheels. It works most of the time, but does slip when the ring has frozen in place. At the moment I have "sabbatical brain" and forget whether the ring is reverse threaded or not.

Velo Mule, I've not had much luck using a drift punch to remove that ring, but it is worth a try. I also use Superlube synthetic grease. A little on your pawls and ratchet teeth won't hurt. keep up the great work on your freewheels!

Kabuki12

I will say that I have done the trick where you soak the freewheel in kerosene ( I use an old coffee can) and then after blowing it out with compressed air allow it to warm up in the sun. While it is warm using 90w gear oil , start dribbling the oil around the rim where the spanner nut is and repeat until the oil starts coming out the large gear side. Spin the freewheel and repeat. It works ok but not a permanent solution. Really they should be disassembled by someone who has the tools. I have seen photos(thank you pastor Bob) of a freewheel apart and that is not something I care to do. After all, if done correctly, it is something that only needs to be done once for thousands of happy pedaling miles. Pastor Bob has done a couple of Regina freewheels for me and they are terrific , the classic “click” of an old ten speed is nice.

dddd

The external lockring is right-hand threaded, so even if you can get a grip on it you also have to hold the freewheel cogs from turning CCW.

Those things are very tough to remove, but some are on tighter than others.

I used to have to take the early HG 6s freewheels apart to source the five largest HG cogs, later used on a 7s Dura-Ace body.
I made a dozen of them using 14-28t and 14-32t HG freewhwheels, still have a few. These customized freewheels sold for almost $200 from the one vendor who listed them.

So, when I removed most of those lockrings, I would usually attack the ring at the bench grinder.

I recall that with Sunrace freewheels, I was able to file two wrench flats onto the OD of their very different lockring. I later modified the handle of an old chain whip to engage two of the four internal lugs.

In this day and age, I have to ask why anyone is wanting to remove a cheap Shimano freewheel's lockring(?), especially as there is no easy or non-destructive way to do it.

curbtender

Because they can?

Bad Lag

Honestly, from your description, I'm under the impression you don't know what you are doing or how to it properly. I don't mean that as a put down, so much as an invitation for you guys to read up on oiling freewheels. Honestly, it couldn't be easier, does not use an oil port and requires removal of absolutely nothing.

67tony 

I'll stick with Pastor Bob's recommendation, and the others, who use a thin grease during re-assembly.
Seems hard to argue the fact that oil runs out...

JohnDThompson 

I've considered doing it just to see if the sprockets would fit on Dura-Ace FW-72nn freewheel bodies. Those are hard to find lately, particularly in the larger tooth counts.

Velo Mule

Thanks Pastor Bob. Maybe I'll try making something. As mentioned by @Prowler, I can't grab it with pliers or ChanneLok's .

Prowler 

Yeah, but where ya gonna find the time to do that?😳 Please start a new thread if you do, and lotsa photos.

Bad Lag

That is not the proposition I am making. I am saying it is super-easy to oil a freewheel. You need to oil the chain, anyway.

If you put so much in that it "runs out", you've put too much in - a self correcting problem.

It's okay, though, you are free to do as you please.

67tony 

Thank you!

67tony 

I hereby designate this as Best Post of the Thread!

Bad Lag

Your freedom is not bestowed by me, merely acknowledged.

Enjoy!