Well I'm looking to begin a new build VERY soon and am lost as to what frame I should go with. I've decided for what I'm going to do with it that I want a steel frame. The question now is which frame? I'm in between the Leader 722TS, IRO Mark V Pro and Pake track frame. I'm currently riding a Windsor (first bike) and I want to upgrade to something that's an all around better/bigger upgrade. I will be mostly using the bike around town/city and it will experience some rough to smooth roads. If you could possibly help me with choosing or maybe even suggest other options I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you guys in advance.

Leader 722 is the nicest frame of the three choices you've got listed.

Pake will give you alittle more $$ for better components, but I say go with Leader. I've been wanting one of those (722TS) for awhile now.

All good choices -

leader wins in looks.
mark v pro wins tubingwise.
pake wins in color, price.

whichever fits your budget. i'd personally go with the mark v pro.

I second the leader. the tubing is a really cool feature. and i think its lighter than the other 2.

Have you weighed the other two?

not on a scale. I did say I think. I've handled all three And the leader feels lighter. i could be imagining It since I own one.

now that I think about it I've never seen the actual weight of the frame anywhere. anyone know?

Just a few questions, the Windsor is a rebadged Fuji according to others, and I'm assuming it's the Hour model & possibly a BD purchase ? So is the Pake really an upgrade or about the same ? Maybe it's just my perception from reading posts so far in the thread, but if the 3 were ranked, Leader is 1st, IRO 2nd and the Pake 3rd ?

Pake may be 3rd, but for the price of ~250, its a great value. I think the leader's not worth it for 380 frame/fork, but then again, the green is pretty sweet. Iro's sit right between them at 320, and with reynolds 631... i think its the best choice.

If you like the looks of the leader and can afford it, go for it. If looks dont matter and you want a lighter bike, go iro. If you like color choices and a good price, pick the pake. Bikesdirect windsor is the same as the fuji - a great starter.

Careful when doing a custom build, as that stem and seatpost that are "only" 100 dollars will soon add up. Invest in good pedals/straps/clips, seat, tires, and hubs, as well as contact points such as grips or bar tape. Don't cheap out on the cog/lockring either, as they will chew up your new hub. Fixed/fixed is the way to go with more options, plus, you can mount a freewheel, and get backup just incase you strip one side's threads.

I say Pake, you say Pake, we all (don't) say pake!

I'd go with the Pake

You people and your steel frames.

Yes, us.

is it pronounced PAKAY or like RAKE (the leaves)

I have wondered this for years.

it was on their old website pa-kay

For the money it is hard to beat the Pake. Plus the color combos are sweet.

Yeah, the new Pakes are nice, especially considering what they cost. If I had the extra money, though, I'd still rather spend it on a Leader. Those 722 frames are really nice. My wife's got one coming in the mail any day now...

I just got one of those crosslakes sales "track frames" on ebay for $127 shipped. It still had the Pake decals on it. I'm pretty happy with the quality of the welds and the paint job is very solid. I got a 57cm and the frame by itself weighs a little less than 4lbs.

Those 722s are really nice. It was hard for me (on a very tight budget) not to spring for one. But the $ I saved on the Pake helped buy some better components than I would have been able to get with the leader.

No familiarity with the Leader, but I just googled and it looks nice, FWIW! It's kind of hard to beat the Mark V Pro for a 631 frameset @ $320. I'd also add that you should consider geometry and fit as well, since a bike that fits will always be the best choice, among three in roughly the same range.

I'm quite taken with Wabi, especially the (unaffordable, to me) Special, but it has a slightly different geometry compared to the others.

Thanks for all the help. So at the end of the day i think people were leaning more towards the Leader. I'm not going cheap on the other components. I already have a brand new Sram Omnium crankset, crank brothers egg beaters (clipless), Origin 8 Pro-Pulsion handlebars (powder coated black) with Fizik bar tape. Soon I'll be ordering the Fizik Aliante saddle and still to decide which stem/seatpost I want. other than that I just needed the right frame for all these parts. I guess Leader 722 it is Thanks again.

A friend of mine shattered his jaw because his Egg Beaters accidentally unclipped when he was mashing up a hill...might want to be careful.

Question: Does the IRO mark v come in any thing other than black/white? Thanks again

Mark V comes in black only, Mark V Pro comes in white. Pro cost more but it is of different tubing than the Mark V.

i have chosen pake because it fits me. may be you should look at the geometry of all three framesets closer to decide...