cyccommute 

I put 'gear' in a different category from 'bike' and I budget accordingly. When someone talks about getting a bike for touring like Bonthius' has, I take them at their word that they are looking for the bike. Now if Bonthius had asked about equipment for touring, that's a different kettle of fish.

The bike is tour ready once you can attach all the gear that you want to carry to it. Any extras that you want on the bike...fenders, front rack, computer, etc...are personal choices and don't really have much impact on the functioning of the bike. Yes, they add expense and add utility but they aren't necessary to the bike's operating as a vehicle for touring.

Ah, fenders. I hate them for all the reasons that you've listed...hassle for maintenance and hassles of getting them in a car...plus a whole host of others. They rattle. They can lead to toe overlap problems on the front wheel. They don't keep me particularly dry in a rain storm because the rain is falling out of the sky and I'm wearing a rain suit anyway. The stays can catch my expensive rain suit and rip it so that now I'll have water pouring into my socks. They have to be removed when I pack up the bike for shipping. Basically, I find that they have too many hassles and not much benefit. If I've got to huck anything around on tour, it's had better have more benefits than hassles.

juggleaddict

All I was getting at is this.

You may budget accordingly, but someone who is asking about their first touring bike may not. . . . hence where I had issues when I was building mine and got sticker shock when I realized the bike itself isn't enough and that it was only half my battle. Just may be good to mention that to anybody asking which bike to get.

tom cotter

I think we are pretty close in our thinking. Still, the 520s, as well as the built up LHTs I've seen weren't quite ready for prime time. IMO, The 520's rear rack, while usable, is not exactly the build quality most of us would accept. And, no front rack at all. The tires are also a no go. Unless you are Ok with Bontrager Race Lites. My 04 520 came with Bontrager kevlar belt tires. 5, count'em 5 flats in three weeks before I threw in the towel and rebooted with Conti Top Touring 2000s. I now run Schwalbes.

The LHTs at my local LBS, Trophy Bikes in Philly, were built up using road gearing and without racks. I don't recall what tires were shoed on the rims only thinking that, that's something else I would need to change.

So, I guess you could tour right off the showroom floor with these bikes but IMO for these reasons, I wouldn't.

I own two 520s, an 89 and an 04. I use one and my son the other. I also had a 96 520, but I sold it about 7 or 8 years ago. So to say i'm a true believer or brand loyal, yeah, that fits!!!

BTW, what rain suit do you use?

cyccommute 

The 520 rack will probably last through a few tours. Maybe even a few years. While something like the Tubus will be used by the cockroaches, the straight rod aluminum racks like the Trek's will last a long time. I've owned lots of racks on lots of bikes and never had to replace one due to failure. The tires would probably work as well. Flats are random events and are more due to where you ride than what kind of tires they are. If the tire doesn't seat on the rim and leads to 4 blowouts in the first day or if the tire separates from the liner due to a minor impact..both of which have happened to me... then there is something wrong with the tire and I'd say ditch them. But for a normal flat? That's just expected operational problems.

The LHT that you reference is different from the 520 or from Surly's LHT Complete and really shouldn't be compared to these bikes. As specified by the manufacturer, the Trek 520 and the Surly LHT are ready to go. If someone specifies other parts for the LHT, which it sounds like they did, that's a different animal.

I will say that I would change all kinds of things on both the 520 and the LHT. Not because they need changing but because I would want to change them for my own tastes. I certainly don't agree with all of the component choices on either bike. I'd dump the barend shifters on both. I'd dump the crank on the LHT. I'd dump the brakes on the 520. I'd 86 both wheelsets. And, most controversially, I'd dump both frames and substitute a Cannondale frame. But then, I'd probably not buy either bike as a complete bike.

My rain suit is an REI breathable jacket (it really isn't), Pearl Izumi breathable pants (which really aren't) and Burley rain shoe covers (which aren't made anymore). "Breathable" fabrics work best if you are just standing around in the rain but if you actually have to exercise in them, it's a toss-up as to whether it would be better to just ride nekkid

OldZephyr

Your bike shop might be building up nice LHTs, but that shop is not building up the LHTs with the stock parts kit from Surly. The stock drive train does not have "road" gearing -- it's a 26-36-48 triple with an 11-34 9 speed cassette, see the 2nd tab on this page for the stock parts kit: https://surlybikes.com/bikes/long_haul_trucker

We have 2 LHTs in our family and both came with that drive train.

I agree that stock LHTs lack racka, fenders, etc. You have to buy those extra (and pedals too).

But as far as the bike itself goes, the LHT really is ready to roll for loaded touring (with the possible exception of the saddle); unlike a number of bikes sold as touring bikes, the gearing is appropriate, and the wheels are stout and reliable.

staehpj1

I didn't read the whole thread so pardon me if I missed some reason this particular 520 is exceptional, but $1100 sounds like way too much for a used 520. Personally I am inclined to buy new unless the used bike is discounted a lot more than that (like 50-60% of new assuming excellent condition and a fairly new bike).

digibud

I would not tour with a compact. That's just me but if one is a double and one a triple you might consider that. For me it would be a major consideration and the reason I'd look at that so closely is because the triple allows you to have closer gear ratios. Some might not care. I get that. For me, however, being able to change a gear ration -just- a bit when I hit a small headwind is a big deal. I loathe changing from one gear to the next and realizing it's more of a jump than I want and now I have to pedal either a bit harder or faster than I wanted. To me, THAT is the best reason to get a triple. Again, I don't know if one or the other of these bikes is a double and the other a single but I would not want to tour on a double.

tom cotter

THX for the rainsuit info. Cycco, sounds like your rainsuit experience is similar to mine. Rain suits become sweat suits regardless of materials and $$$ spent.

I figured the LHTs the shop was selling were one offs because the specs didn't match anything I was reading on the net. To this day, other than some Bikes on tour, they remain the only built up LHTs i've ever seen.

I'll stand by my experience that the stock racks on a 520 aren't the way to go for loaded touring. And, neither are the tires. The Bontragers, in a word - Suck!!! I ride several bikes, not just the 520. The only tires to flat repeatedly on my training route, the Bontragers. Interestingly, a few years ago I bought a Trek 6000 series Mountain bike. It too comes with Bontrager tires. Because they were mountain bike tires I gave them the benefit of a doubt. Again a mistake! They flatted on a regualr basis. So off they came. The too many flats problem solved! Maybe it's just me. But my experience is the only basis i can use to form an opinion. And, Bontragers just don't work for me.

cyccommute 

There was an article in Outside magazine a while back about Goretex and other breathable fabrics. They came to the conclusion that breathable fabrics are great if you are just sitting around but if you actually exercise in them and it's not pouring buckets, a wind and water resistant fabric might be a better choice.

Let's just disagree on the racks and tires. The stock rack will last a while and I've never run across any tire that was particularly good at preventing flats nor particularly prone to letting them happen. But I live where there are goatheads and I run liners all the time.

tom cotter

+1, agree to disagree.

No goatheads where I live. But I do live in Jersey, so maybe that explains it!!!!

The rain gear thing is frustrating. Summer, mostly we're talking thunderstorms where a little rain is sometimes welcome. The temps are warm enough on most days that even if you are uncomfortable being wet you aren't going to freeze. Those all day soakers are a different story. As are cool/cold spring and fall days.