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Old 02-19-24, 09:55 PM
  #26  
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Bike jambalaya you have sort of gone off the rails a little, not sure why? Anyway you have a bike of some sort you needed wheels, your local shop is likely to have those wheels you might need. We are only guessing on what is needed because like other posters have mentioned you have given us no info. It is not bothering someone to go in with your bike and say "I would like to get wheels for this, what do you have in stock or what do you recommend?" I wouldn't be mad if you came into my shop. I would be happy to have your business and probably would chat about bikes for a while. I like the odd projects and so long as you weren't being a total crazy to the point of just not listening and arguing in a negative way I am happy to have y'all in.

We cannot guess but your local shop can actually put in the stand and measure or at least see the bike and make the determination nobody here can. If you didn't want our help I would say don't ask. If you want our help understand we are trying to provide you with good help even if you feel it is not good because we aren't saying "buy the wrong thing" and you just waste money. I don't like seeing people do that. I have done that enough for my own projects if I can help someone else prevent that it is a good thing. In the end it is your money and your can do with it as you please but if you are just going to throw it away on stuff that won't work for your project give it to me and I can help with my projects or put it towards the business or donate it to a bike non-profit.

If you want to be pouty and mad and whatever go for it but don't direct that negative energy at us. We have helped you for free and really asked nothing in return. If you are regularly pissing off your local shop look inwards first and see what you can change on your front and if they are also at fault ask to speak to the owner in a polite and respectful way and explain your side of the story in calm fashion without all the emotion or personal attacks and then see what they do. If they don't change then move on to another shop if they do you have effected positive change and done a good thing and you can continue to shop there.
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Old 02-19-24, 10:28 PM
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If I read enough between the lines to guess, although I could be wrong, I think the OP might have a 5 speed freewheel (equaling a 10 speed bike) and that is why 120mm track hub was the question.

If this is true, you might need to direct what wheel to get with the C&V people. If not, I give up and can’t help you.

Your main issue would be finding a new 120mm freewheel rear wheel. Maybe not an easy task, especially for less than $200. Tons of used ones out there, but ???

Most likely you’ll need a 126mm and remove a DS spacer and re-dish. The re-dish part may be a problem. I’ve split the 126mm/130mm, but not sure if there are enough spoke threads for a 126mm/120mm.

Depending on the LBS, this may be easy or not. The reality is there might be a limit on how many decades back a shop can support. Not a case of abilities, but time and effort at what expense. I don’t know.

John

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Old 02-20-24, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
I need wheels right now. I found some vuelta track wheels that are in my budget. A question I have is will I have any issues using my bikes original 10 speed freewheel on the rear of a single speed track wheel. I like these wheel because they are 36 hole rear and 32 hole front. I am aware that more spokes can give a more comfortable ride. These particular wheels look to have high flange hubs as track wheels do. In this configuration does the flange height of the hubs negate comfort characteristics that you might get by having 36 and 32 spoke wheels compared to something with less. I'm not a racer by any means. I just ride with my friends or solo. I want to invest in a road bike tubeless setup this year. How many spokes would be recommended for me at 185lbs. Probably still just under 200 with backpack with supplies. good vision so very few pot holes are hit and no fgfs or wheelie ing. While running 700 35c tires in urban metropolitan areas and no plans to run any cargo accessories.

I would want to run rims brakes. How many spokes should I aim for front and back. What type of spokes might I want and how high of a flange height should I try to have.
Please clarify: When you say "10 speed freewheel", do you mean 10 cogs (sprockets) on the rear axle alone, or from an old "10-speed bike", which means 5 cogs on the rear wheel?

I ask because modern "10 speed" rears, mean 10 cogs on the axle, but ALWAYS on a *freehub*, this is a "cassette" system, NOT a freewheel, that is different.

Hub flange diameter doesn't affect ride quality. Biggest difference is between (any) crossed spoking pattern, and "radial" spokes. I strongly recommend against radial, it is not as durable, and requires higher tension to stay in true. Whether 4X, 3X, or 2X, depends on the number of holes and rim size with respect to hub flange size.

Last edited by Duragrouch; 02-20-24 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 02-20-24, 06:30 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Duragrouch
Please clarify: When you say "10 speed freewheel", do you mean 10 cogs (sprockets) on the rear axle alone, or from an old "10-speed bike", which means 5 cogs on the rear wheel?

I ask because modern "10 speed" rears, mean 10 cogs on the axle, but ALWAYS on a *freehub*, this is a "cassette" system, NOT a freewheel, that is different.

Hub flange diameter doesn't affect ride quality. Biggest difference is between (any) crossed spoking pattern, and "radial" spokes. I strongly recommend against radial, it is not as durable, and requires higher tension to stay in true. Whether 4X, 3X, or 2X, depends on the number of holes and rim size with respect to hub flange size.
RIGHT! - I was kind of stunned to see that it looks like someone does make a 10spd FREEWHEEL ebay link
anyways - i don't expect the OP to respond again. don't think it's an actual chat bot trolling the site, but perhaps someone snowed in with no fat bike access.
cheers
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Old 02-20-24, 02:13 PM
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Some people like to send people on down to the lbs. I'm just saying. I wonder what reaction I would get if I really did go down to my lbs with no intention of buying anything ask a bunch of random questions in random order. Possibly buy some dice air caps. Reminds me a lot of my young days at the rc car and hobby store. I appreciate the willingness to take the time to attempt to share what you know or ask me to help you further in order to help me in return. As it is everyone's right to reply. Let's be conservative if we are merely bicycle enthusiasts and not actual bicycle mechanics or active wheel builders in this case. In the frame builders section of this forum I got a reply from a frame builder. In the mechanical section of this forum It feels like enthusiasts suggesting the local bike mechanic. Or telling me I didn't provide enough information. If you need to know everything you don't actually know. Like they say if you know what your doing you can do it in the dark. Do I get popcorn 🍿 too I get it support your lbs. I'm with it. but... How about annoy the Internet before you go annoy your lbs. That's makes more sense to me. Coming here to refine thoughts or ideas before going into the lbs. With knowledge he does not yet posses because there not on the hunt for new information like I am. It's not a good solution to recommend a visit to an lbs from a keyboard. It's not an effective one. It's like telling someone to eat something after they have expressed being hungry. There going to feed themselves regardless and inevitably. So telling that person to eat something did not do anything for them. Leave the local bike shops out of it. When it comes to seeking information that is available here. You just have to sift through the purist and snobs
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Old 02-20-24, 02:22 PM
  #31  
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For the people suggesting to go to the lbs and ask my questions. May I please ask those .

What questions did I ask here that the only possible person cabable of answering it is a local bike shop


That's really all I want to know at this point.
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Old 02-20-24, 02:33 PM
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I consider myself to blame. I thought I could ask a multiple part question and I know that never works.

Recap of op
1. Can I get a thread on freewheel with 5 gears on it that was meant for a "10 speed bike" with two chrings up front and 5 in the back. To work on a "track wheel" that came originally with a thread on freewheel that had 1 gear on it.
*Read an old thread that with a person that did it. Also read here from people that never have that I can't.



2. At 185lbs running 35c tires in a urban and metro area. What is a recommend spoke count for my size and usage.
*Some said no less than 24 👌

3. Does the use of a high flange hubs negate possible comfort characteristics of running a wheels with a higher spike count.
*Still anxious waiting to learn something new
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Old 02-20-24, 03:04 PM
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Can I use this flip flop hub with a freewheel?
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Old 02-20-24, 03:07 PM
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1- Yes----- and no.

If it's a double side hub it has the right thread. If not, the thread is correct, but too short to handle the torque of a larger low gear sprocket.

Then, there's the question of spacing. Track hubs, usually have larger flange separation, so after you replace the right side, you may not have enough frame width. So make some basic measurements before you commit to anything.

2 - at your weight, on urban streets, I'd stick with proven 32h wheels. The ONLY benefit of lower spoke counts is aero, and you won't be moving fast enough to think about that.

3- Flange size doesn't matter, except in theory.
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Old 02-20-24, 03:07 PM
  #35  
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1. Do you really have a 10 speed freewheel? Though they are out there, I've never seen one in person. If you are certain it's not a free hub and cassette, then just look for a wheel set that has a hub for a thread on FW. But not knowing anything about your bike, most of us will be hard pressed to give you any info on what will be appropriate. If it is instead a free wheel and casstte, then look for a wheelset in your price range that comes with a 10 speed free hub. If you can't tell from the advertisement details, then call or email the vendor with that question.

edit... Oh ten speed bike, so its really a five speed rear. Stop that. Ever since the turn of the Century, we started referring to speeds of a bike as only the number of sprockets on the rear. You ought to be able to find a inexpensive wheelset with a thread on hub for your freewheel. Might just get a new freewheel too. FW's are cheap.

Regardless, the OLD spacing on the track hub probably isn't the same as your bike. And again, you'd likely need to have the wheel dished to properly fit your bike. So why not just get a wheel that is made for your type of bike.

2. A 185 pounds, I wouldn't be concerned with needing a special wheel or spoke count. Your weight isn't enough to be a big factor for your average run of the mill wheel sets. Unless perhaps you have pegs on the rear and like to do wheelies and bounce up and down on the rear wheel.

3. High flange or low flange is fine for what your normal bike riding is. The use of the high flange helps build some strength for the extreme forces the powerful track cyclist put into their wheels while competing with each other. It generally makes for a more uncomfortable ride. But maybe only marginally. I doubt you'll be putting your bike to the extremes that track cyclists or any pro cyclists do.

Last edited by Iride01; 02-20-24 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 02-20-24, 03:36 PM
  #36  
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You weigh about the same as I did (3kilos more than I do now) when I was running fulcrum zeros. They have 21 / 16 spokes. Never had a problem.

edit: with either comfort or reliability.

Last edited by choddo; 02-20-24 at 03:51 PM.
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Old 02-20-24, 04:07 PM
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Just weird random questions that arise as side thoughts when I'm looking of other information about bikes. No real motivation from me personally to suit up and clip in and head on down to have a cup of tea or coffee and talk bikes. As the shop cats rubs against my leg. Not my thing.

I emailed velocity wheels just because. Gave them the same information and they recommend me their a23 hoop. That comes in pretty much all the main spoke counts.

I don't have a budget I was just shopping for a bike I just got with 27" wheels and spotted a set of 36 and 32 spoke wheels. For $40 locally like hours after reading more spokes equals more comfort. They just so happened to be "track wheels" because of the flip flop hub but they have msw so I thought they can be good this bike. Then we'll suited for a road bike that my dads wants that I'll eventually put together.

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Old 02-20-24, 04:09 PM
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I still think the Classic and Vintage folks can offer more info on the options of finding a new 120mm OLD wheel; with a 5 speed freewheel.

Part of me still thinks the answer is a more common 126mm (freewheel) and reduce it to 120mm and re-dish. That would be the route I would take. You may end up at 122 OLD, which would probably be fine.

John

Edit Added: Obviously building a wheel solves a multitude of issues. At that point, the number of crosses, double butted spokes, as well as the advantage of picking the hub comes into play. Unfortunately low cost is probably not part of the equation.

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Old 02-20-24, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by mrv
RIGHT! - I was kind of stunned to see that it looks like someone does make a 10spd FREEWHEEL ebay link
anyways - i don't expect the OP to respond again. don't think it's an actual chat bot trolling the site, but perhaps someone snowed in with no fat bike access.
cheers
Wow that's nuts see that's what I'm talking about. I've done it time and time again. The bike shop is telling me that the part that I need to do what I want doesn't even exist lol then I show them this link. Then it's awkward like I'm trying to upstaging him. When Im trying to build my bike. Lol wow that's amazing I thought free wheels only came in up to 7 gears. That's cool. I also recently read on this great forum that. Sticking ten *I can't even say 10 speed* sticking 10,9,8 gear ⚙️ cassettes was more than doable on steel roadie frames. It was said to be easier than going from a 5 gears freewheel to a 7 gear freewheel. This was because the 11 tooth gear is easier to sneak behind the Rd. Compared to the smallest 14 tooth on the 7 gear cassette.

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Old 02-20-24, 04:36 PM
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Lol that's funny about the snowed in part. No snow but it has been raining for almost 3 days.
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Old 02-20-24, 05:26 PM
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BF people:

About telling bike jambalaya to go to an LBS - in every one of his posts, right under his name, he's written "my lbs is 124 miles away."

bike jambalaya:

One reason you're getting push-back is that you didn't provide enough information for anyone to do better than guess at what you need. That's a little bit on you, I guess, and somewhat on them, too. They don't get that you don't know what to ask and that you don't know what information would be useful and what isn't. That's when they start acting like MVA employees do when you show up without exactly the documents you need.

But now we know that you need 27" wheels. (By the way, that size disappeared from the bike market a good 20 years ago or so, or maybe earlier.)

The good news is that 27" wheels are still sold by a few on-line businesses.

Here's what you need to know: the overall wheel size for the front and rear wheels (27") and the axle length, from locknut to locknut of the axle.

To determine the axle length, measure the inside faces of the rear dropouts that hold the axle, in millimeters. The measurement should be about 124 to 126 mm for a wheel designed for five sprockets.

That's it. Those two dimensions: 27" overall wheel size, locknut-to-locknut measurement. (That's also called the over-locknut dimension. You might see it abbreviated as OLD.)

Chances are all the 27" wheels you'll see are going to have aluminum rims, but if there's a choice between aluminum and steel rims, go for aluminum. They're lighter, and rim brakes work better on aluminum than steel.

Also, make sure the wheels are described as quick-release wheels (as opposed to nutted wheels, like BMX bikes) and that they come with the necessary quick-release skewers. (For explanations of anything I mention that you're not sure about, I suggest looking for YouTube videos rather than asking here, for obvious reasons.)

That's pretty much it. The only possible stumbling block: if the original wheels used nuts instead of quick releases, the rear dropouts may be a little too thin. When that's the case, the quick release might not be able to clamp to the dropouts with full force, and the wheel can slip forward when pedaling at high effort.

There are various fixes for that. Me, I'd just file the ends of the hollow axle until the ends no longer protrude past the outer faces of the dropouts.

Good luck.

Quick edit:

Order 27" tires and tubes and "rim strips," too. (Rim strips protect the inner tube from the sharp ends of the spokes.)

And if you don't have the specialty tool needed to pull off the existing 5-speed freewheel, if there is one, your best bet will be to just buy a new freewheel. A standard one with 13 or 14 teeth for the small sprocket and 28 teeth for the large sprocket should be fine.

Can't hurt to buy a new chain, too. (Might need a chain tool, too.)

Again, once you've got all the parts, look on YouTube for info on how to install everything.

And all these parts will be very inexpensive, as bike stuff goes.

Last edited by Trakhak; 02-20-24 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 02-20-24, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
BF people:

About telling bike jambalaya to go to an LBS - in every one of his posts, right under his name, he's written "my lbs is 124 miles away."

.
He only just edited that and it gets applied retrospectively to all his post headers.
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Old 02-20-24, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
BF people:

About telling bike jambalaya to go to an LBS - in every one of his posts, right under his name, he's written "my lbs is 124 miles away."

bike jambalaya:

One reason you're getting push-back is that you didn't provide enough information for anyone to do better than guess at what you need. That's a little bit on you, I guess, and somewhat on them, too. They don't get that you don't know what to ask and that you don't know what information would be useful and what isn't. That's when they start acting like MVA employees do when you show up without exactly the documents you need.

But now we know that you need 27" wheels. (By the way, that size disappeared from the bike market a good 20 years ago or so, or maybe earlier.)
s.
It's funny to me how after reading the op and more you decided that i have conveyed in any way that I "need" or am seeking 27" wheels.
​​​​​​👌
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Old 02-20-24, 06:50 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
It's funny to me how after reading the op and more you decided that i have conveyed in any way that I "need" or am seeking 27" wheels.
​​​​​​👌
It's not like you really gave us much info so we have to guess everything. If you come out and give us useful info from the get-go we can give useful solutions.

At the time we all posted nobody knew your local shop was that far away. That sucks to be in the middle of the sticks like that no bike shop nearby. In the end we all suggested going there because they can see your bike and give you actual info that is useful. Since we cannot see it and cannot really figure out what you needed from the lack of info posted originally.

Relax a little which hopefully you are (text is poor a conveying emotion) and in the future just give us more info at the beginning if you need help and if people give you useful info but like in the case it is not practical for you just say thank you for the help but and then a short explanation so we all know. Make it easy for everyone including yourself.
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Old 02-20-24, 07:01 PM
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So many words and yet still no information to actually clarify what the OP needs.
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Old 02-20-24, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bboy314
So many words and yet still no information to actually clarify what the OP needs.

​​​​​​Lol people state not enough info is provided but never clarify what it is that they are missing. Lol I get a kick out of it.
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Old 02-20-24, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by veganbikes
It's not like you really gave us much info so we have to guess everything. If you come out and give us useful info from the get-go we can give useful solutions.
.
Let's say I call BS

What information in fact did I not provide you. That can't do without. Must be enough to list a few or important enough to actually handicap you.

Please enlighten me on what information you did not have.
So that I can improve.

I don't live in the sticks I just hope that those words will act as a repellant for those who habitually suggest a lbs visit. *coughs like you

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Old 02-20-24, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
​​​​​​Lol people state not enough info is provided but never clarify what it is that they are missing. Lol I get a kick out of it.
Type of bike? Rim diameter? Hub spacing? Gearing requirements? Reason for wheel replacement? Is it a 40 year old Schwinn Varsity or a 2024 Trek Madone? Etc…
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Old 02-20-24, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by bboy314
Type of bike? Rim diameter? Hub spacing? Gearing requirements? Reason for wheel replacement? Is it a 40 year old Schwinn Varsity or a 2024 Trek Madone? Etc…
1983 nishiki international 27" wheels hub spacing is 5 1/4 inches lol reason is the rear wheels came bent and in 27" that I don't want. Now what magic will see

Last edited by Bike jambalaya; 02-20-24 at 08:16 PM.
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Old 02-20-24, 10:03 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
It's funny to me how after reading the op and more you decided that i have conveyed in any way that I "need" or am seeking 27" wheels.
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Maybe it is because you vaguely said so below?

Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
I don't have a budget I was just shopping for a bike I just got with 27" wheels and spotted a set of 36 and 32 spoke wheels. For $40 locally like hours after reading more spokes equals more comfort. They just so happened to be "track wheels" because of the flip flop hub but they have msw so I thought they can be good this bike. Then we'll suited for a road bike that my dads wants that I'll eventually put together.
If this is not the case why not just clearly state what size wheels you are looking for?

Originally Posted by Bike jambalaya
1983 nishiki international 27" wheels hub spacing is 5 1/4 inches lol reason is the rear wheels came bent and in 27" that I don't want. Now what magic will see
If your bike comes with 27" wheels, but you don't want to replace them with other 27" wheels, how will the brakes work? Or are you turning it into a track bike and thus don't need brakes? This is logic, not magic.

Last edited by SoSmellyAir; 02-20-24 at 10:06 PM.
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