Bare Carré
06-20-18 | 01:45 PM
#1
Thread Starter
If I own it, I ride it
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,685
Likes: 820
From: Cardinal Country
Bikes: Lejeune(14), Raleigh, Raysport, Jan De Reus, Gazelle, Masi, B. Carré(4), Springfield, Greg Lemond, Andre Bertin, Schwinn Paramount
Bare Carré
I am in the process of preparing a Durifort (I think) tube B. Carré for refinish and thought I would share some looks at the bare frame.
20180620_112533 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112811 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112757 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112751 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112637 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112719 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112659 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112533 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112811 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112757 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112751 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112637 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112719 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180620_112659 by L Travers, on Flickr
06-20-18 | 02:10 PM
#3
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,352
Likes: 5,169
From: Central Virginia
Bikes: Numerous
Gorgeous. Aren't steel bikes cool?
__________________
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, 81 Masi Gran Criterium, 81 Merckx Pro, 89 Cinelli Supercorsa, 83 Bianchi Specialissima, VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, Rivendell Rambouillet, Heron Randonneur, 92 Ciöcc Columbus EL
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, 81 Masi Gran Criterium, 81 Merckx Pro, 89 Cinelli Supercorsa, 83 Bianchi Specialissima, VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, Rivendell Rambouillet, Heron Randonneur, 92 Ciöcc Columbus EL
06-20-18 | 05:22 PM
#5
Bike Butcher of Portland
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 12,448
Likes: 7,981
From: Portland, OR
Bikes: It's complicated.
Love the slightly abbreviated stay caps. The shorelines are perfect, real craftsmanship.
The French get it right when they're not cranking out volume.
The French get it right when they're not cranking out volume.
__________________
If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
06-20-18 | 09:47 PM
#8
Thread Starter
If I own it, I ride it
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,685
Likes: 820
From: Cardinal Country
Bikes: Lejeune(14), Raleigh, Raysport, Jan De Reus, Gazelle, Masi, B. Carré(4), Springfield, Greg Lemond, Andre Bertin, Schwinn Paramount
Citristrip. It did a fairly complete job. Then went over it with wire brushes and finally a stiff fiber cup on a drill. Working on a ding in the top tube, too.
It will reappear as a mid-60s Sauvage Lejeune.
This is the first bare frame I have seen in the flesh. I am taken by the beauty of the brass flows and the file marks. I was surprised at how little brass is visible. I am impressed by the workmanship that went into this. Makes me appreciate M. Carré all the more.
It will reappear as a mid-60s Sauvage Lejeune.
This is the first bare frame I have seen in the flesh. I am taken by the beauty of the brass flows and the file marks. I was surprised at how little brass is visible. I am impressed by the workmanship that went into this. Makes me appreciate M. Carré all the more.
06-20-18 | 10:16 PM
#9
It will reappear as a mid-60s Sauvage Lejeune.
This is the first bare frame I have seen in the flesh. I am taken by the beauty of the brass flows and the file marks. I was surprised at how little brass is visible. I am impressed by the workmanship that went into this. Makes me appreciate M. Carré all the more.
*
06-20-18 | 11:07 PM
#10
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,376
Likes: 161
From: Capestang, France
Bikes: Lots of French, some British and a couple of Italian
It does make me wonder about a full repaint on mine. The main reason I've not done that is the original hand painted gold highlighting on the DT lettering, but the paint and chrome are in a shocking state otherwise. Look forward to seeing the birth of a Sauvage Lejeune!
06-21-18 | 01:05 AM
#11
verktyg
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,034
Likes: 1,271
From: SF Bay Area
Bikes: Current favorites: 1988 Peugeot Birraritz, 1984 Gitane Super Corsa, 1980s DeRosa, 1981 Bianchi Campione Del Mondo, 1992 Paramount OS, 1988 Colnago Technos, 1985 RalieghUSA SBDU Team Pro
Durifort Tubing
Lynn,
Nice... +1
Durifort with butted main tubes from the 1960's to the mid 1970's had the same wall thickness tubing as the Reynolds 531 "Sport" tube sets used on a large number of production frames back then: 1.0mm x 0.7mm thick butted main tubes, the stays were about the same too, but the fork blade were 0.2mm thicker.
Reynolds 531 was about 35% stronger than Durifort in the "pre-brazed" condition. Durifort was much less sensitive to heat so the after brazing strength was only 20-25% less than 531. (Vitus 172 was closer to 531 in strength.)
Durifort tubing was seamed but the main tubes were cold worked to size which eliminated any shortcomings..
Here's an older spec sheet showing slightly thicker main tubes. Note: Rubis 888 and Durifort 888 were the same thing. The main tubes were 0.8mm straight gage. I think that it may have been a rounding error:
The tubes were embossed with DURIFORT but sometimes it wasn't deep enough to see.
from the late 60's until the early 70's Durifort came with these water slide decals. They were pretty fragile so many times they didn't survive normal use. The next ones used this design but on a foil film self adhesive base.
About 1973-74 they switched to this design, first on Mylar foil then using thin self adhesive film.
The mid 70's version.
I put more miles on my Bertin C34 with a Durifort frame than any other bike that I've owned.
I used Durifort tubing on the first frames that I built in 1976 because it was very forgiving with regards to over heating plus it was cheap ~$11 a set.
verktyg
Nice... +1
Durifort with butted main tubes from the 1960's to the mid 1970's had the same wall thickness tubing as the Reynolds 531 "Sport" tube sets used on a large number of production frames back then: 1.0mm x 0.7mm thick butted main tubes, the stays were about the same too, but the fork blade were 0.2mm thicker.
Reynolds 531 was about 35% stronger than Durifort in the "pre-brazed" condition. Durifort was much less sensitive to heat so the after brazing strength was only 20-25% less than 531. (Vitus 172 was closer to 531 in strength.)
Durifort tubing was seamed but the main tubes were cold worked to size which eliminated any shortcomings..
Here's an older spec sheet showing slightly thicker main tubes. Note: Rubis 888 and Durifort 888 were the same thing. The main tubes were 0.8mm straight gage. I think that it may have been a rounding error:
The tubes were embossed with DURIFORT but sometimes it wasn't deep enough to see.
from the late 60's until the early 70's Durifort came with these water slide decals. They were pretty fragile so many times they didn't survive normal use. The next ones used this design but on a foil film self adhesive base.
About 1973-74 they switched to this design, first on Mylar foil then using thin self adhesive film.
The mid 70's version.
I put more miles on my Bertin C34 with a Durifort frame than any other bike that I've owned.
I used Durifort tubing on the first frames that I built in 1976 because it was very forgiving with regards to over heating plus it was cheap ~$11 a set.
verktyg
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Last edited by verktyg; 06-21-18 at 01:14 AM.
06-21-18 | 12:02 PM
#12
Thread Starter
If I own it, I ride it
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,685
Likes: 820
From: Cardinal Country
Bikes: Lejeune(14), Raleigh, Raysport, Jan De Reus, Gazelle, Masi, B. Carré(4), Springfield, Greg Lemond, Andre Bertin, Schwinn Paramount
@ verktyg
Chas. If I read the spec sheet right for the tubing, then seat post diameter should be 26.4, 26.5, 27.0, or 27.1mm? If that is the case, then I wonder if I have Durifort. I am not home to check, but I recall the ID of this one being 26.0mm. Will have to check when I get home. Could be a case of tube squash.
Chas. If I read the spec sheet right for the tubing, then seat post diameter should be 26.4, 26.5, 27.0, or 27.1mm? If that is the case, then I wonder if I have Durifort. I am not home to check, but I recall the ID of this one being 26.0mm. Will have to check when I get home. Could be a case of tube squash.
06-21-18 | 12:43 PM
#13
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 15,369
Likes: 4,391
From: Alta California
-----
T-Mar has written that the year for the disappearance of the small spring hole for the Campag Sport model rear mech in the Campag 1010 right dropout was 1973.
Absence of hole here would suggest frame not earlier. Am definitely not expert in such matters so there may well be something I am missing. Or, is there perhaps evidence of hole being filled?
-----
T-Mar has written that the year for the disappearance of the small spring hole for the Campag Sport model rear mech in the Campag 1010 right dropout was 1973.
Absence of hole here would suggest frame not earlier. Am definitely not expert in such matters so there may well be something I am missing. Or, is there perhaps evidence of hole being filled?
-----
06-21-18 | 01:44 PM
#14
Thread Starter
If I own it, I ride it
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,685
Likes: 820
From: Cardinal Country
Bikes: Lejeune(14), Raleigh, Raysport, Jan De Reus, Gazelle, Masi, B. Carré(4), Springfield, Greg Lemond, Andre Bertin, Schwinn Paramount
-----
T-Mar has written that the year for the disappearance of the small spring hole for the Campag Sport model rear mech in the Campag 1010 right dropout was 1973.
Absence of hole here would suggest frame not earlier. Am definitely not expert in such matters so there may well be something I am missing. Or, is there perhaps evidence of hole being filled?
-----
T-Mar has written that the year for the disappearance of the small spring hole for the Campag Sport model rear mech in the Campag 1010 right dropout was 1973.
Absence of hole here would suggest frame not earlier. Am definitely not expert in such matters so there may well be something I am missing. Or, is there perhaps evidence of hole being filled?
-----
06-21-18 | 03:10 PM
#15
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 15,369
Likes: 4,391
From: Alta California
Thanks Lynn!
Recalled that you had written the Sauvage badge ended ~1968-69.
Sauvage much fun due to the non-PC head emblem.
Looking forward to following this venture as it moves along...
-----
06-25-18 | 05:17 PM
#16
Thread Starter
If I own it, I ride it
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,685
Likes: 820
From: Cardinal Country
Bikes: Lejeune(14), Raleigh, Raysport, Jan De Reus, Gazelle, Masi, B. Carré(4), Springfield, Greg Lemond, Andre Bertin, Schwinn Paramount
First steps.
Today I shot the frame with self-etching primer. Got careless and had a bit of a run, but it came out okay for the most part. i will let it dry a couple of days, resolve the run and give it another shot.
20180625_122830 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180625_122916 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180625_123223 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180625_123231 by L Travers, on Flickr
20180625_122830 by L Travers, on Flickr20180625_122916 by L Travers, on Flickr20180625_123223 by L Travers, on Flickr20180625_123231 by L Travers, on Flickr
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