TimmyT 

It's probably a mix of Columbus SLX/SP, etc to the order's specifications. While I'm sure it happened, it wasn't like frames built by hand had an SLX tube and hi-ten on the same frame ... possible but really unlikely. It's a high end frame. As @KonAaron Snake mentioned, BMZ did a lot of contract work and produced many nice frames.

TimmyT 

Not always. I spoke to a woman who was selling her ex-husband's Davidson a month or two ago. She had it appraised by a well-known internet dealer who would buy it for less than half of the value. She figured it had to be worth more, but she was like, "F**k it, and f**k my ex-husband. I want this out of my garage, so I'm going to pass on the deal to someone else." And she did....... The point of the story is that you can get great deals even if someone suspects what they have. Divorce/break up sales are by far the best way to get stuff for cheap because an ex is selling out of spite.

camelopardalis

Agreed. In this case, she knew what she had and was willingly parting with it for less than full value. You simply became the beneficiary.

plonz 

Why buy a Tag when a Timex keeps time perfectly well.. Or a Gucci when a Fossil serves the same purpose.

American vanity and shallowness of course! Seriously, the Performance frame is probably as good as its name brand counterparts but carries none of the cachet or prestige. No different from Nashbar, which doesn't even label many of its frames these days.

DQRider 

You, my friend, are cursed with a Conscience; and therefore make a lousy Capitalist. Just like me...

nesteel 

It's the internet age. Get with the times, or get taken.

Vintage_Cyclist

A friend of mine had (I think he still has it) a mid-80s Performance Blue Ridge sports touring frame, built up with SunTour Superbe. It's a great frame. All Columbus SL, Campy dropouts, with fully chromed forks and stays. I think that was one of the Biemzetta also.

artclone

Very cool Bob Jackson steel Merlin Racing Cycles w/DA, drillium
57cm $750 in SF

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/bik/5736276067.html

tmh657

I like this color and the price. The original stem would be nice, IMO.

CENTURION IRONMAN DAVE SCOTT ROAD BIKE 52CM

TimmyT 

Ha! I wish. I was second in line

GTizzy

You don't sound like a very friendly character.

When I was younger I bargained hard. Eventually, I realized that cut-throat bargaining leaves a seller feeling cheated / bested at the end of a deal.

In my estimation, $50 of savings isn't worth it if it comes at the cost of another person's well-being.

thumpism 

I'm with you. When I moved to Vermont many years ago I got rid of everything in my apartment. I particularly remember one guy tipping paperbacks off the shelf into a box and telling me, despite the sign saying each cost twenty-five cents, "I pay a dime for paperbacks." My response? "Put them back. I'd rather give them to friends than sell them to you. And get out of my apartment."

------------------------------

Back on track for this thread, you don't see many of these for sale.

GT FORCE LIGHT WEIGHT BICYCLE

GT FORCE LIGHT WEIGHT BICYCLE - $250



Good shape call
show contact info
god bless

DQRider 

This is a fascinating topic. It's one that my friends and I have discussed from time to time, and opinions differ with age and personality type.

When you are young and hungry, eager to prove yourself, of course you are going to drive a hard bargain. There is no other sensible alternative, in your mind. To be labeled a "sucker" or worse can really ruin your day. This is the natural aggression of youth.

As we get older, our circumstances change. Some who are driven and remain aggressive become successful. This success can sometimes bring wisdom, in which case we become less aggressive in our bargaining and actually consider factors other than our own self-enrichment. This can bring satisfaction, and a sense of balance to our lives.

But sometimes success causes one to keep pushing; to never be satisfied and always be looking for BiggerBetterFasterMore! You look at these folks and wonder why, with all they have accumulated, they never seem to be happy unless they are rubbing it in somebody else's face. It is a one-dimensional existence, with no balance, no satisfaction, no peace of mind. I feel sorry for people like that.

Sorry for the sermon. My wife tells me I think too much...

TimmyT 

I have owned at least 10 Timex watches, mainly Ironman or Ironman-like. The band breaks after about 2 years of use. A new band is about the cost of the watch, so I typically buy a new watch. I have accepted that they don't last that long.

Fossil watches are crap, IMO. I was travelling and forgot said Timex. The only watch place I could find expediently was a Fossil shop. Since then, the trim for the lettering in the crystal has fallen apart so that there are little pieces floating in the face. Furthermore, they charge for the service of screwing off the back to insert a new battery (not pay for the battery). The tool to do this is not a standard piece of kit. (I've since learned to do it with a pair of jeweler's screwdrivers.)

I've never owned a Tag or Gucci, and probably never will, but IMO Fossil watches and service are crap.

gomango

I don't recall my wife saying that once over the last thirty years together.

nesteel 

It's pretty much situational at our house:


Sometimes she asks me what I was thinking.


Sometimes she asks me IF I was thinking at all.

camelopardalis

No apologies needed. And thank you for your excellent post. We can all use a bit of profundity in our daily existence. There is only so much talk about food and celebrities that I can stand.

Is it true that conversations in the East Coast are more insightful than in the West? We seem to be cursed with trivialities around here.

KonAaron Snake 

That's a different kind of "deal", and you're going to get less money in a situation like that. She knew and understood it, and half appraisal (assuming adequate appraisal) isn't unreasonable.

What bothers me (and I firmly agree with camelguy) isn't getting a bike inexpensively, it's the sticking in the knife. If someone asks $100 for a de rosa...ok. They could have done more research and they've made a decision. I'm fine with someone buying it for $100...what they asked. What pisses me off is when people brag about twisting in the knife afterwards...when they bargain her down to $60. You know it's a good deal...shut up and give her the money.

I have no problem with one party buying cheap and selling high. I have a problem with being a schmuck about it. I think I'm a pretty good capitalist...and I don't stick the knife in un-necassarilly.

I generally find the focus on "look how little I paid!" Kind of tacky...it's bike forums, not pawnforums. What you paid doesn't make the bike nicer or less nice...and it's your business, not ours. It's a tacky brag IMO.

randyjawa 

Yup, that is exactly how I scored an old Marinoni with first generation Super Record fitted. Did I feel bad about getting it for $30.00? Not a chance! That said...

I will not take advantage of people who appear to be resource limited. I have, many times, warned sellers that they are asking too little. The most memorable was with an older lady selling used horse saddles - $25.00 each. There was a military saddle from WW1 and a lovely hand tooled, and I mean fancy tooling, saddle complete wish silver badges fitted with that green stone from Mexico (turquoise).

I warned her that she might want to ask more and offered to place them on the internet for her, providing she would accept phone calls regarding the saddles. She agreed and I helped. I also warned her that her prewar something or other step through with skirt guard was worth more than she was asking. I did not buy the bike but I advised her to add a hundred dollars to the asking price. She did.

Some time later she called me and gave me a lovely antique bottle that I had admired when at her place. Now that made my day! I still have the bottle.

DQRider 

Well, I haven't spent much time on the East Coast. I live right smack in the middle of "Flyover Land", northern division.

I did spend the entire decade of the 1980s stationed with the Marines on the West Coast, and I remember thinking at the time how unreal life could seem out there, where everything we saw on TV was about us. The only deep, philosophical conversations we had were fueled by alcohol and/or other substances, and any profound insights were mostly forgotten the next morning.

But I wouldn't sell the West short: You have some amazing people and organizations out there exploring the deeper truths of human existence - the Esalen Institute at Big Sur comes to mind as just one example. If you include the desert Southwest, you have all sorts of deep, mysterious goings-on out there amidst the cacti.

Then there's Portland and Seattle, with... whatever it is they have going on there. I hear it rains a lot, and that has to have a profound effect on their mental state; much like the long, dark and cold winters do to us up here. Again, while I think cultural differences exist between various locations, ultimately it comes down to personality types and how they interact.

TimmyT 

It was an interesting conversation. a) She knew that the bike was worth more than the appraisal because the person would resell it. I'm guessing that the appraisal was at 50% of value. b) She didn't know how much it was worth (I didn't either.)

I agree with your points. There's a lot of flaunting on C&V, especially on crap I'd never buy.

There's a time to draw the knife and then turn, but normally if I feel like something is funny, I walk away. I don't want to do business with someone who I have to knife.

KonAaron Snake 

Agree 100%, and it's changed as I've gotten older. When I was younger...I'd fight over a penny, I'd argue for a dollar on principle. Now? If the cable bill is $20 over I usually don't bother...because the 3 hours and aggravation it's going to take to fix isn't worth the $20. Long, extensive negotiations are HARD WORK...it's grueling. I only do it if there's really something I want on the other end. Or I get paid to do it. I could be spending that three hours on a bike, or with my wife, or studying, or making real money, or chatting on BF. Something I ENJOY.

A rather good friend changed how I look at things...analyze a situation and ask "what's the win?" A lot of the time "winning" isn't an actual win for you.

When you're post-break up, or after a death, I think you're usually just lookimg to move on and be done. When my brother in law passed we basically just put everything on the curb and posted a free cycle ad. I'm sure there was money there that we passed up...but was that money worth the emotional aggravation?

The woman in your story...lets go on the high side and say it was a really special bike worth $2000...and she sold for $800. Was futzing around with an ex's bike for $1200 worth it? She doesn't know how to market, sell, ship a bike....it takes time and work to do those things, especially your first time. Was that worth 1200? MAybe, maybe not...it depends...but I certainly don't think it's irrational to say screw it.

camelopardalis

Worth repeating. Wish I've heard this before. I know I'll be saying it a lot.

jet sanchEz

I am the worst haggler because I was told by my father at a very early age that the best deal is one where both parties walk away happy

KonAaron Snake 

If you're interested, my advice is to RUN...

I'd be surprised if this makes it an hour:

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Salsa Fargo Touring Bike W/Extras new price. - $600 (Ambler)



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make / manufacturer: Salsa
model name / number: Fargo

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Used Salsa Fargo. 2011/2012 X7 medium frame. Belonged to good friend and riding buddy who passed away and was left to me. Car engine froze need to get a car. Hate to sell it , but as I'm on SS. No choice. If interested email or call. All serious questions answered. Have more pics.