Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Berthoud Saddle:final verdict

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Berthoud Saddle:final verdict

Old 08-14-11, 01:38 PM
  #1  
SoreFeet
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 11 Times in 8 Posts
Berthoud Saddle:final verdict

Overall I would not recommend this brand of seat to fellow retro-grouch leather lovers. The overall sticker price and quality simply do not add up. The rails of the saddle require another machined part to hold the rails in place. This feature is design flaw. The Berthoud saddles are not true tensioned leather saddles.

The cover is made from CNC'd thick leather. It's thickness is impressive however the way it is attached in the Berthoud mechanism is flawed. The rails are press fit into a plastic assembly. The rivets are removable.

The saddle can be repaired or taken apart but what good is it if the design is flawed. If a saddle is going to have a rider on it, the rails should not simply be press fit into a plastic polycarbonate plastic plate. It should we welded metal with no potential for twisting or slipping.

Once again it's not a true tensioned leather saddle. The Brooks design has the saddle molded specifically for it's own rail system. The leather when attached to the rails is tight. The rails are welded and won't twist or slip, unless the leather is far too supple.

Please note I am reviewing the Galiber titanium race saddle. The saddle is far too expensive. For the same amount of money I can get a hand hammered copper rivet Brooks. The handmade craftsmanship and old world charm simply don't come with the high price tag of the Berthoud.

Both the Berthoud and Swift saddle feature a fairly narrow hide and that does not really leave enough material for lacing when well broken in. That feature is something every person ought to consider. The Brooks team pro has enough leather to be butchered and tied.

IMO the Berthoud saddle had a good idea but the cheapness of materials and design does not offer a better alternative than Brooks. Some will argue that quality of Berthoud can compete with Brooks. I do not agree at all.

I can't stress enough that the Berthoud is simply a pre-molded hide attached with screws. The Brooks method is different because the leather mold is intended to be fixed to the frame with rivets. The shape is tightly adhered and holds tension and shape.

So.. folks...Anybody who wants to trade a like new or slightly used Brooks Professional for the Berthoud can shoot me an e-mail. Don't get mad because "I told you so"
SoreFeet is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 02:02 PM
  #2  
illwafer
)) <> ((
 
illwafer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,411
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
sorefeet,

just my advice, but you don't need to make a thread for every saddle you get...and then another for a follow up. please bump your original posts instead.
illwafer is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 02:06 PM
  #3  
Capecodder
Senior Member
 
Capecodder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Somewhere Between The Beginning And The End
Posts: 1,994
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Not Again
:deadhorse 2:
Capecodder is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 02:40 PM
  #4  
bionnaki
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 886
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
my berthoud saddle does not twist or slip -- it's solid. how much do you weigh?

I find the construction to be top-notch.

as for saddle comfort, that's such a personal thing. works great for me, but perhaps not for everyone.
bionnaki is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 02:54 PM
  #5  
-holiday76
No one cares
 
-holiday76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Yardley, Pa
Posts: 6,142
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 223 Post(s)
Liked 82 Times in 56 Posts
Honest question : did you even try riding the saddle? How many miles?

I don't understand how you can offer a review and expect to have it taken seriously when it makes absolutely no mention of how the saddle rides, is it comfortable, is it durable etc etc. I get that you're trying to tell us it isnt a tensioned saddle and by simply looking at it you feel it wasnt worth the money, but is the point of a saddle supposed to be to provide a platform from with you sit on to ride your bike?

So, maybe you just forgot to mention how it rides, how long it took to break in, how it feels after 20 40 or 60 miles on it. How it holds up in different conditions, how durable it is based on using it, and so on. I get that you're not comfortable with how it was built by looking at it, but so what? It's a freakin bike seat. How do you think it functions as a bike seat???
IMO if you added that I'd be able to take your reviews much more seriously. Without that this just seems utterly ridiculous.
__________________
I prefer emails to private messages - holiday76@gmail.com
Jack Taylor Super Tourer Tandem (FOR SALE), Jack Taylor Tour of Britain, Px-10, Carlton Flyer, Fuji The Finest, Salsa Fargo, Santa Cruz Tallboy, Carver All-Road .


-holiday76 is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 03:12 PM
  #6  
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 16,456

Bikes: 1980 Masi, 1984 Mondonico, 1984 Trek 610, 1980 Woodrup Giro, 2005 Mondonico Futura Leggera ELOS, 1967 PX10E, 1971 Peugeot UO-8

Mentioned: 47 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1684 Post(s)
Liked 554 Times in 417 Posts
Originally Posted by SoreFeet View Post
Overall I would not recommend this brand of seat.
This is all we really needed to hear. The rest was done a few weeks ago.

I know one thing. If I seek out a used Berthoud, I won't seek out yours.
Road Fan is online now  
Old 08-14-11, 03:52 PM
  #7  
Johnny Alien
I drank the Kool-Aid!
 
Johnny Alien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Harrisburg, PA
Posts: 561

Bikes: Rivendell Saluki, Rivendell Charlie Gallop Protovelo

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by illwafer View Post
sorefeet,

just my advice, but you don't need to make a thread for every saddle you get...and then another for a follow up. please bump your original posts instead.
That thread was a mess of abuse and not enjoyable to read. I think a new thread is better than bringing that one back up. Of course this one will probably turn into the same so I guess it doesn't matter.
Johnny Alien is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 03:58 PM
  #8  
bigbossman 
Dolce far niente
 
bigbossman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 10,834
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by Capecodder View Post
Not Again
:deadhorse 2:
Hey - I wonder if the hide from these dead horses might be a suitable material for saddle leather..... or do you think they've been beaten too severely already?
__________________
"Love is not the dying moan of a distant violin, itís the triumphant twang of a bedspring."

S. J. Perelman
bigbossman is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:02 PM
  #9  
mkeller234
Rustbelt Rider
 
mkeller234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canton, OH
Posts: 9,123

Bikes: 1990 Trek 1420 - 1978 Raleigh Professional - 1973 Schwinn Collegiate - 1974 Schwinn Suburban

Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 258 Post(s)
Liked 356 Times in 171 Posts
Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
Hey - I wonder if the hide from these dead horses might be a suitable material for saddle leather..... or do you think they've been beaten too severely already?

That just makes the leather more pliable.

I'm interested in seeing a response to Holiday76's question. Did the extra piece help secure the rails?
__________________
|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^| ||
|......GO.BROWNS........| ||'|";, ___.
|_..._..._______===|=||_|__|..., ] -
"(@)'(@)"""''"**|(@)(@)*****''(@)
mkeller234 is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:10 PM
  #10  
frenchbikefan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: phoenix
Posts: 513

Bikes: Miyata 110, Schwinn super le tour 12.2, Schwinn super sport, Lemond Zurich

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
hey, how do you make the beating a dead horse icon? I NEED that
frenchbikefan is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:17 PM
  #11  
KonAaron Snake 
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
 
KonAaron Snake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 17,227

Bikes: Two wheeled ones

Mentioned: 42 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1254 Post(s)
Liked 335 Times in 170 Posts
Sorefeet...since you've crapped on Berthoud and Brooks, what exactly do you recommend?
KonAaron Snake is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:44 PM
  #12  
Onions
Insane Member
 
Onions's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 125

Bikes: Huffy Grand Prairie 15sp MTB (don't hate!), 1980 Schwinn World Tourist, 1976 Schwinn Traveler, 1974 Romic Custom (project bike!)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
fbf,

Hit reply with quote under the post. Read the quoted text.

BE AMAZED.
Onions is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:47 PM
  #13  
rhm
multimodal commuter
 
rhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, NYC, LI
Posts: 19,807

Bikes: 1940s Fothergill, 1959 Allegro Special, 1963? Claud Butler Olympic Sprint, Lambert 'Clubman', 1974 Fuji "the Ace", 1976 Holdsworth 650b conversion rando bike, 1983 Trek 720 tourer, 1984 Counterpoint Opus II, 1993 Basso Gap, 2010 Downtube 8h, and...

Mentioned: 566 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1886 Post(s)
Liked 476 Times in 295 Posts
Dead horse?

Type "deadhorse" but change the quotation marks to colons.
Lots of words work that way, such as beer but for some reason not wine :wine: nor :frenchfries:

Or, below the smileys menu, hit "more" and scroll down. There's some good ones down there.

Voulez-vouz de fritte avec ca?
rhm is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:49 PM
  #14  
smoothness 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Hub of the Universe, MA
Posts: 548

Bikes: Centurions, Shoguns, and Stumpjumpers

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 79 Post(s)
Liked 8 Times in 6 Posts
i bet he's going to recommend something old, out of production, and "made better back then than they do now." i'm selling flame suits and torches if anyone wants one.

positive commentary: everyone's rear end is different. as you age, something you thought fit your behind like butter might have turned into a block of lard.

second piece of positive commentary: i went to harris and asked one of the workers there who had something like ten brooks' saddles on his fleet of bicycle. he said he loved the berthoud, and it was worth every penny. however, it was too expensive to justify the cost of replacing all of his saddles. he bought the saddle on a whim, threw it on one of his bicycles, and took a tour all the way to the end of the cape and back without issue.
smoothness is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 04:57 PM
  #15  
Capecodder
Senior Member
 
Capecodder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Somewhere Between The Beginning And The End
Posts: 1,994
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
Hey - I wonder if the hide from these dead horses might be a suitable material for saddle leather..... or do you think they've been beaten too severely already?
I'm treating the hide, then I'll apply Proofide.
Capecodder is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 05:11 PM
  #16  
lostarchitect 
incazzare.
 
lostarchitect's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Catskills/Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 6,976

Bikes: See sig

Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 40 Post(s)
Liked 49 Times in 32 Posts
He did say he was trying out Brooks "select" saddles and seemed to like them more.
__________________
1964 JRJ (Bob Jackson), 1973 Wes Mason, 1974 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1986 Schwinn High Sierra, 2000ish Colian (Colin Laing), 2011 Dick Chafe, 2013 Velo Orange Pass Hunter
lostarchitect is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 07:56 PM
  #17  
Puget Pounder
Wookie Jesus inspires me.
 
Puget Pounder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by lostarchitect View Post
He did say he was trying out Brooks "select" saddles and seemed to like them more.
give it a week
Puget Pounder is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 08:03 PM
  #18  
bbattle
.
 
bbattle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Rocket City, No'ala
Posts: 12,760

Bikes: 2014 Trek Domane 5.2, 1985 Pinarello Treviso, 1990 Gardin Shred, 2006 Bianchi San Jose

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 24 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
Sorefeet...since you've crapped on Berthoud and Brooks, what exactly do you recommend?

One of these:
bbattle is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 08:33 PM
  #19  
AZORCH
Senior Member
 
AZORCH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Liberty, Missouri
Posts: 3,131

Bikes: 1966 Paramount | 1971 Raleigh International | ca. 1970 Bernard Carre | 1989 Waterford Paramount | 2012 Boulder Brevet | 2019 Specialized Diverge

Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 128 Post(s)
Liked 68 Times in 35 Posts
Man, "fit" and "comfort" are so darned subjective. "Quality" may be less so, but everyone has to be on the same page about what constitutes "quality" - I'm certainly thinking craftsmanship, durability, functionality, etc. I've ridden all sorts of saddles over the years and have zeroed in on about three that best fit my personal needs for different riding situations and which have stood the test of time and use (mine.) But those are my own personal opinions and it took a lot of miles and hours in the saddle for me to reach those opinions. Other people will feel differently, and that's ok by me - it's their butt. For me, the value of this thread would be to describe what works and what doesn't: give me a reason to pay the extra scratch for this saddle, or not.
AZORCH is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 08:39 PM
  #20  
fender1
Senior Member
 
fender1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Berwyn PA
Posts: 6,349

Bikes: I hate bikes!

Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 395 Post(s)
Liked 556 Times in 186 Posts
Opinion as fact. Nothing to see here... move along people.....
fender1 is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 08:45 PM
  #21  
David Newton
Wood
 
David Newton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Beaumont, Tx
Posts: 2,304

Bikes: Raleigh Sports: hers. Vianelli Professional & Bridgestone 300: mine

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 10 Times in 8 Posts
This is like one of those things that are ugly, but you can't look away...
David Newton is offline  
Old 08-14-11, 08:45 PM
  #22  
bbattle
.
 
bbattle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Rocket City, No'ala
Posts: 12,760

Bikes: 2014 Trek Domane 5.2, 1985 Pinarello Treviso, 1990 Gardin Shred, 2006 Bianchi San Jose

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 24 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by AZORCH View Post
Man, "fit" and "comfort" are so darned subjective. "Quality" may be less so, but everyone has to be on the same page about what constitutes "quality" - I'm certainly thinking craftsmanship, durability, functionality, etc. I've ridden all sorts of saddles over the years and have zeroed in on about three that best fit my personal needs for different riding situations and which have stood the test of time and use (mine.) But those are my own personal opinions and it took a lot of miles and hours in the saddle for me to reach those opinions. Other people will feel differently, and that's ok by me - it's their butt. For me, the value of this thread would be to describe what works and what doesn't: give me a reason to pay the extra scratch for this saddle, or not.
Sorefeet had a couple of threads complaining of the poor quality of first a Brooks and then the Berthould. Both of which stretched out of shape on him in record time. The Berthould came apart on him but the company sent him a part or something which fixed it but he doesn't like the construction of the Berthould. Apparently, he still wants another Brooks; why I have no idea. I'm pretty sure if he posted another saddle thread he'd get banned.

Sorefeet, just get a Lorica covered plastic saddle and be done with it.
bbattle is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Bone Machine
Classic & Vintage
10
09-10-17 06:15 PM
The Thin Man
Classic & Vintage
19
01-10-17 01:58 AM
spectastic
Touring
27
10-02-16 01:20 PM
neondave
Classic & Vintage
13
03-20-11 12:30 PM
sauerwald
Commuting
12
03-02-11 07:24 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.