I don't find it's that much different than the skills used in mountain biking. It's a lot more difficult than riding on pavement, yes, but they're not really special skills.

While I agree with you, I also think MattH has a point although inelegantly stated. Studded tires are great for ice but for unpacked or packed snow their utility isn't as great. A good set of knobbies does a good job on snow.

Isn't that what studded tires are? Knobbies + Metal?

riding through and over ice, snow, slush and all of their various textures and combinations is absolutely a special skill compared to riding on dry pavement.

from my experiences, studded tires have made a tremendous difference (marathon winters), but i live in chicago where ice is the main winter riding obstacle i face as opposed to deep snow. chicago's fleet of plow trucks is MASSIVE and vigilant. streets rarely stayed filled with snow for long.

Some are knobbier than others. Marathon winters, for instance, are pretty knobless. They work great on ice, well on plain pavement (though slow and loud), not so hot in snow. Something like the Nokkian extreme is a full out mountain bike knobbie with studs.

While I admire all those who ride through the winter and in the snow, the streets sometimes get so slick here in the winter it is hard to stand let alone ride a bike. Slipping and falling off the bike happens so fast there is no time to react. For me, if there is packed snow or black ice on the ground I take the car.

+1, same here.

compared to a non-studded tire, marathon winters are slow. however, my set of marathon winters (700x35) are faster than my old schwalbe snow studs (26x1.90) that i ran on my old mountain bike. the 26" version of the snow studs were fairly knobby and geared more towards snow than ice. the marathon winters are much smoother, though with enough tread to get me through 95% of what i deal with during a typical chicago winter.

for a studded tire, i've found my marathon winters to be decently fast-rolling (because they're not particularly knobby).

the thing that really slows all studded tires down is the fact that you have to lower the pressure if you want the studs to do their job. rolling studded tires at 90psi will not give you nearly as much traction on black ice as rolling them at 45psi.

There are several types of studded tires.
1. Minimal knobbies, with studs in the center for black ice on plowed roads
2. Regular knobbies with studs all around for good snow an ice travel on generally plowed roads
3. Extreme studded knobbies for single track or extremely icy and deep snows on off road conditions

Different riding styles and areas required different types of tires. Plain Knobbies are only good for dry snow. Emphasis: No ice riding unless you have studs, or you will go down so fast you won't know what hit you. And still, you need to use caution, keep the speed down turn gradually. This has been what I learned in the last 40 winters or so. In the early days, we had to make our own snow tires and studs. Boy, they were crude to say the least. Thank god for technology today.

You can ride studs on stuff you can't walk or stand on.

Ah, I see what you're getting at, I'm used to 700/23-28 near slick for commuting, so for me upgrading to a 700/35 studded/knobbie is Knobbie as all get out, but for other people it prob. barely counts.

I rode 700x35 marathon winters, in Chicago, last "winter". They're slow, they're loud. They're faster and less loud than the Nokians I have on my other bike, but compared to the paselas the bike wears three seasons, they're really slow and loud. (and I'm pretty blissfully unaware of differences in tires). My commute is largely on secondary and residential streets, which get plowed well after the main thorough fares, so morning snow has me riding in on unplowed streets, and afternoon snow gets me going home. Not that it's snowed this winter, to speak of. the marathons were okay up to about an inch or so of fresh snow. more than that, they spins and slip. Fine on hardpack, ice, and pavement. We'll see, if it ever snows, what the Nokians are like.

in other news, after exhaustive studies, scientists have now determined that monster trucks are slower than formula 1 race cars.

i find very little use in comparing the speed of studded tires to non-studded tires. you might as well compare the speed of a track bike to a cross-country bike. very different tools for very different jobs.

Yeah, but one's faster, right?

+1.

I once rode across a parking lot (on a side hill), then dismounted, and promptly fell on my @$$.

I imagine though you must see some pretty severe snow. We got 13 inches last week and I simply can't find a route to work. The streets are plowed somewhat but I end up walking much more than times affords. (Luckily I'm on a good bus route...)

I see Montreal just got 45 cm of snow the other day. I imagine upstate New York must get snow like that once in a while...

Here on the lake, we got six to eight inches from that storm. We generally get only the fringe of the nor'easters. (Although the one today seems to be straying west more than usual.) In R-Town, six to eight inches is the sort of thing we get every week to 10 days through out the winter, so it's something the DPW crews are used to dealing with. It's just par for the course.

Lake Ontario is large enough to make its own weather, like all the Great Lakes do. We get "lake-effect" snow nearly every single day, so the DPW crews are out every single day. That's what keeps things passable here. They don't wait until it's over before going out. They're out anyway. If they waited until it stopped snowing before they cleared the roads here, then they'd be waiting to St. Paddy's Day.

Thus, despite the region's reputation for snowfall, the roads are clear or nearly so for the vast majority of the winter. The worst I usually deal with is my building's driveway.

This morning I'll carry my bike to the curb. I'm subbing at a different library branch than my own this morning. If the sidewalk plows haven't been out yet, I'll have to carry my bike over the snowbank lining the street to get to the door. At my branch the staff entrance is off the parking lot, which is generally plowed long before I get there at lunch time.

That's for a typical winter, of course. Last year was way different. This year is shaping up to be typical, although it got off to a late start.

(And what's all this nonsense with named snow storms? Here, it would make more sense to name the sunny days. There are fewer of those. We might get as far as Sunny Day Harold in a usual winter.)

Sounds like your ability to bike through the winter depends largely on the city's keeping the streets clear. Same thing here... generally my neighborhood has well-plowed streets, so I can get to the grocery store. And as a general rule, the city keep a good network of "snow routes". Only problem with the latest blizzard is that the city's pre-storm salting did not fully take care of ice build-up.

That and the fact that the last two winters have been pretty mild... and I'm finding it difficult to adjust.

That's the thing, you can never tell. All I want is my shifters to unfreeze so I can downshift and not have it in the highest ring. Then I could do it. But for now it's 25 during the day so I'll just have to wait til it warms up = D. If I had to go down any steep hills you can bet I'll walk them down. That wouldn't be fun. I get hit on those hills when it's dry. At least I get to ride up the hills, boy...never thought I'd say that. Winter sux : (.

If you apply some WD40 that should do the trick. Some commuters travel with it. I just apply it occasionally when I think the FD might have contacted some spray.

On packed snow and ice is when studded tires work their magic.

I really want to ride my single speed tomorrow the 4 miles to the bus. I think I'd miss the snow in the am, but we are looking at 2" to 4" during the day with temps around 30. It has 700x28 non-studded tires. I'll see how the ride home on the MUP goes. If I have to walk it, I guess that's how it will be. I thought about purchasing studded tires, but it just doesn't snow enough in Kansas City for me to justify the cost.

I had to laugh with you tsl, my brother! I have done the same thing. I forget the conditions because I'm no slower on ice than without. The studded tires are quite effective. Then I go down to the ground. When I decided to go studded I went around a corner and forgot the usual black ice from the previous day's melt. Down I went and that night I made up some pop rivet studs for my Chinamart mountain bike. (W/Kendas) Then I started saving for a better China made Trek 520.