Ok, so I've run tubeless now going on 4 years. I ran a conversion kit for 3.5 with non UST tires, and never had a flat. For the past .5 year I've run the same type of non UST tires, Maxxis CrossMark, on my ZTR tubeless rims, and still haven't had a flat. It's not like I'm riding in Georgia on nice paths either, I'm in freaking Arizona, and I ride hard. Lots of jagged rocks, thorns on everything, and harsh temperatures.

The guys at my LBS all race, ride hard, and are tubeless as well. Same story as me, they're so confident that they don't even carry a tube or a pump on the bike. None of those three have had a puncture outside of a couple catastrophic explosions that would render the tire useless even with a tube. Get a thorn? pull it out and watch the Stan's goo fill up the hole and harden almost immediately.

So this is where I get confused. Why do I hang out in the shop and hear countless people turn down any thought of going tubeless? I watch people on the trail changing tires constantly and when I suggest on the group ride that they go tubeless, they sneer at me in revolt as if I'd suggested they blow a guy in the alley for cocaine. Meanwhile, I keep on riding and they keep getting flats. We had 14 flats on a group ride last Wednesday between a total of 10 riders. None of those flats were on the 4 bikes in the group with tubeless tires. Not one.

Why, when I suggest to a good friend, that he make his newly built Superfly 29'er SLX tubeless, does he tell me tubeless is a dumb fad that doesn't work? Then he texts me saying he got two flats on a ride through the neighborhood, saying he only has one tube. He's been on these group rides where the tubeless guys are as close to invencible as you can get. He has witnessed this first hand, yet still refuses to spend the $75 on going tubeless... that's about the cost of 8 flats between tubes and Co2 cartridges.

I just don't get it... maybe it's different in some parts of the country, but in a place like Phoenix, why the hell would anyone refuse tubeless? Is it just some newfangled technology that the ol' schoolers don't want because they don't understand it? Is it something that happens because they heard it from a friend who heard it from a guy who knows the owner of a shop's wife that tubeless stinks?

WHY!?

/end rant

I rode a rockier'n'crap trail with a few friends here in the midwest. 2 of them were running tubeless. I run DH tubes 1/2 the time, but not that day. I didn't have a flat. The guy running tubeless had 2 seperate issues that day of his tires burbing air on harder hits. The other rider that day had a similar issue.

I'm a bigger dude so if I run pressures lower than 32-35psi, I'll roll the daggum tire off the rim. I usually run 38psi with DH tubes. So what's the point of going tubeless for a guy like me?

If I were just riding XC all day keeping my hiney planted on a saddle, spinning smooth circles as my trendy new dually 29'er glided over cobble...I'd probably do alright with it. As soon as I hit a corner though...my bike would feel all squirrely b/c there's not enough psi in the tire to support my 2bills.



Side note:
You sure piss and moan alot about people who disagree with your opinion. I guess if everyone's a "know-it-all" punk and can't take your suggestions as suggestions instead of someone telling them what they need to do...they they probably react like some "back-alley-coke'n'blow" thingy like you suggested. That part I don't agree with. (the manner in which they respond to you) However...if someone likes to run tubes for a valid reason, I'd just let it go.

I think I'd be more inclined to work a little harder to accomodate a Stan's system if I lived in your geo though.

The point of going tubeless for a guy like me was to not have flats. It has nothing to do with tire pressures for me as I still run about 36-38psi.

and as for people's reactions, they can almost never explain why they don't want to go tubeless.

I've seen the same thing here in the southeast on rocky sections of trail. We don't have many problems with thorns either.

I just run lightweight tubes and be done with it. I typically get one flat every three years.

It's like any other equipment choice in mountain biking, what works for one person may not work for someone else.

that is rather miraculous with tubes. I ride with the same 7-10 people every wednesday and it's always the same guys getting flats and ti seems like a tube lasts on average 2-4 rides.

I understand your comment about equipment choice, but it seems like tubeless works better for everyone who has it set up properly.

We don't have the *sharp* vegetation you have out west. I'd be rocking the tubless setup for sure if I lived out there.

+1

I have had a tube last a whole season. Only reason I changed it was b/c I couldn't have such an old tube in there "next year". There were times when I'd go 6mo w/o a flat. Then I'd have a flat the next 2-3times out...every time. For the most part around here...I can go 3-9mo w/o flatting.


Definitely has alot to do with location.

One thing I'll share with you -- I've led many group rides and it is extremely annoying to have the same mofo's experience the same mechanical problems again, again and again.

yup. I had a thread about that a while back. I get so frustrated when Tom has a flat every ride, has to borrow a tire lever, and accept a donated tube and cartridge. At some point, will tom puchase his own stuff? It's great he is riding that $350 Bikes Direct special, but it'd be great if he would throw about $100 at it for tubeless and stop making me wait for him to change tubes all the time.

Roughly two years on a tubeless setup.

One sidewall cut that that was too big for the goop to seal. Walked out from that one.

Two burp/tire roll incident. Reseated the bead, aired up with a co2 and was good to go both times.

Way, way fewer issues for me with this setup than running tubes, and way fewer flats. Pinch flats around here are the norm on many rides. YMMV. I'm only running it in the rear though, since that is where I'm prone to pinching. I still carry a tube/levers/patches/pump.
Can run my favorite single ply tires, and not stupid high pressures, and not pinch flat.

Yes, it's not quite as set and forget as tubes, but IMO, well worth it for me. Granted, I'm running a Gorilla tape ghetto setup.

It probably happens because you're such a ******bag. I feel sorry for the guy who has to fix a flat and deal with your attitude at the same time.

I run tubes because tubes have worked well for me for a long time.
I run tubes because I like not having to have a compressor to seat the bead on a tire.
I run tubes because tubeless does not solve any problem that I have.
I run tubes because I have to carry a tube in case of flat anyway.
I run tubes because they last longer than 2-4 rides.
I run tubes because they make great dog toys when they do wear out.
I run tubes because they have them in stock at the shop in Allahabad.
I run tubes because I can swap tires around between my new bike and my old bikes.
I run tubes because I have a lot of tubes sitting around almost all the time.

wow jumping to name calling? Great job, adult.

As you can see, I've replied to your post in bold. Obviously this is my opinion vs. yours and we are both entitled. I also won't call you any nasty names in unwarranted fashion either.

+1 lol
Theres always good entertainment on this forum. To many people seem to want to argue on this rather than ride there bicycle.
kind of seems like a shame .....

If it's any consolation the superfly's are having issues with their stays failing on both the hardtail and superfly 100. The carbon is separating from the sleeve inside and coming apart.

If I was to build a full on bike for trail riding or for other purposes other than DJ's/street/or pumptracks I would definitely go tubeless.

Oh, good luck with that.

thanks, been having good luck for 4 years. Not one flat except where I shredded my tire on a rock. That would have flatted any set up.

I have a history of pinch-flatting when I'm monster-trucking rock gardens on my hardtail, so I finally decided to give tubeless a whirl. I built race wheels (NoTubes Alpine) and bought a Shimano XT wheelset for "daily driver" wheels.

The first problem I had, was that my Continental X-King RaceSport tires, despite being billed as tubeless-ready, kept developing gusher-level leaks on the sidewall at the tread cap. Repeatedly. On four of four tires. Scrubbed 'em out and all that, still no joy. Four different sealants, including Stan's and SlimePro, couldn't get them to hold pressure even on the street.

OK fine. Schwalbe seems to have their act together, lemme try the Rocket Ron 2.25s. Light, fat, has some tread, and they HOLD AIR! ...unless I monster-truck rock gardens at warp speed in a race, on my fancy-pants NoTubes Alpines, in which case they burp. In two of two races. Wait, what were we trying to do again?

I think they'd hold on a true UST rim like my Shimano XT M775s, or if I didn't get quite so wild in the rocks, but for the moment I'm racing on tubed tires again, on the Alpines. We don't have a significant thorn/cactus problem here, so the lack of self-sealing on small punctures isn't a major detraction for me personally.

You're both wrong. You both suck. I'm the only one who could possibly be right on the inter webz...you have to agree with all that I say and do.

Rant over...


...or just begun.

I'm not touching this one with a 100ft long pole.

Or in LOLcat:

That was just un-called-for.

Truly a low blow...in the back alley.

I will explain. But first let me say that if I were going on rides and flatting when the tubeless people were not flatting, then I'd figure out the tubeless bit in a big hurry. However, I can recall only two flats in the almost 11 years that I've lived in my current location.

So I've not gone tubeless because: a) doing so would solve no problem that I am having, and b) I've made a conscious choice to stay with what I'm comfortable with until I'm in the mood to learn something new. You see, I will decide when I want to invest in a new skill and the tools to go with it, not you.

FWIW, my "new skill" goal this summer is to learn to lace my own wheels. Tubeless is on the list. It's just further down.

Well worth the time and effort. I learned from Brandt's book. A hand-built wheel is much more durable than a machine-built one. And building wheels is fun! You really gain an appreciation of what a beautiful and elegant structure a bicycle wheel is.

Pretty much the same situation for me. I had some flats earlier this year due to rim tape/spoke issues. Right now I'm not really interested in tubeless - but then most of my riding is fire roads and jeep trails. I can understand questioning why if you're in an area like 50 miles south or north of me where goat head thorns abound on the trails and flats area a constant problems. But, I don't have to deal with it here.

If I was going to go tubeless I'd want to do it the right way with new rims, etc. and not try to "convert" my rims to a tubeless set up. That's not worth the time, effort to me or $ right now. Heck, look at what I ride it'd cost me more than what I paid for my bikes.

My side note:
I see similar issues with my road bikes. I went to 100% sew up tires last year. Even with the training tires the tubular set up provides such a nice ride that I can't understand why others won't try it. A buddy of mine asks me all the time about the set up but isn't willing to try it. Something about getting a flat on the road freaks him out. All ya gotta do is peel off the one tire, put on the spare and inflate. No messing with tubes, etc. However, it's not worth banging my head against the wall if people aren't willing to try it.