No. Neither are really any good for you, it's just that the abuse of one is way worse than the abuse of the other...Alcohol causes people to become loud, overtly emotional, and combative.

Marijuana, has more of a calming affect. However it wreaks havoc on your respiratory system and it is more carcinogenic than tobacco, if smoked in similar quantities.

Tobacco is bad too!

If you really want to experience the all time high of a lifetime, just go touring!

See the studies in post 60. Whole lot of evidence that moderate consumption of alcohol is in fact good for you.

In fact the effect is so strong, that on a population basis, the positive effect for moderate drinkers outeighs the harm from abuse.

On a side note, Minor Threat (straight edge) is best listened to while drinking.

Each has their own belief system. Some drink, some don't. There are those who believe in moderation and there are those who take things to the extreme on both ends.

Then you have those that believe they have the superior belief system and that those who do not believe as they do, need to be eradicated.

I usually have a beer or two at breakfast time but that's about it.

Start a thread about helmets, riding with head/earphones and such. Go ahead...I dare ya...heck, I double dog dare ya!

after the shower scotch.

A wise man said:
"Everything is poison and nothing is without poison".

It all comes down to merit and knowing one's limits, like in everything else a man does.

P.S. On nice occasions with good friends it feels great to get drunk or high. I do it from time to time and have never regreated it.

There really aren't a lot of drinkers here....

Until just recently I've been a bit of a heavy drinker with a handful of beers each night (mostly draft, craft beers) and even just in the last week where I transitioned to a vodka or two in lieu (har har, funny funny) I lost a few pounds and generally feel better. That being said I think I have a finite time before I'll have to reintroduce the beers. Mmm..IPA's

I was never much of a drinker until I discovered a taste for nice beers. Now it's a bit of a second hobby, discovering new and interesting sorts.

I don't like to get drunk though, and they have way too many calories for anything but occasional consumption.

It's my opinion alone that it is evil, clearly.

That "growing evidence that consumption of alcohol makes you live longer" is relating to a very small amount per day; not the amount consumed by the average person in this day and age.

I.E, this from your little list. An Italian study of 1,536 men aged 45-65 found that about two years of life were gained by moderate drinkers (1-4 drinks per day) in comparison with occasional and heavy drinkers.21

Truth.

And you think the positive effects outweigh the negative effects of alcohol in society?

Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. A Ben Franklin quote, who most would agree was a wise chap

Being evil implies intent. Alcohol (ethanol in this case) is just a substance. It can't exhibit any thought, experience emotions, or have an intent. It may potentate "evil" behavior when consumed by people, but it doesn't know that.

Apocryphal, albeit based on an actual quote about rain and grapes.

Thank you he who takes everything 100% literally. I think Mars Bars are evil too, those little gooey bars of evil.

I gave up alcohol for Lent. A week left.

Things I noticed since giving it up: Acid reflux greatly reduced. The first week I often didn't feel well, and thought a drink would help. After that, the cravings (and the not feeling well) went away. Mild withdrawal perhaps? Prior to that I was a daily, but moderate (usually 1 or 2 per day) drinker.

When Easter comes, I will resume drinking, but cut back from where I was prior to quitting.

The one you happened to cherry pick shows 2 years added life for moderate drinking, up to 4 drinks per day. I'll sign up for that program.

I'm not arguing that it's a good idea to drink heavily. I am arguing there are positive ways to use alcohol, and thus alcohol per se is not evil. Simply because there are also harmful inappropriate uses does not make the substance evil.


Yes. Three of the studies in post 60 clearly show that the net positive health effect of moderate consumption more than trumps the public health negatives of abuse.

Alcohol prevents more deaths than its abuse causes in the United Kingdom, according to research from the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine.28
•Scientists at the University of London concluded that light and moderate drinking saves more lives in England and Wales than are lost through the abuse of alcohol. If everyone abstained from alcohol, death rates would be significantly higher.29
•The Cancer Council of New South Wales concludes that "If the net effect of total alcohol consumption on Australian society is considered, there is a net saving of lives due to the protective effect of low levels of consumption on cardiovascular disease

Add in the hedonic pleasure from alcohol, the social lubricant, etc. and the net effect of alcohol is a positive, admittedly with negatives, but on balance a positive.

And the vast majority of civilized cultures in the world that embrace alcohol, and reject prohibition would tend to confirm that this is a widely held conclusion.

Not all definitions of the word imply intent.

I like pie, too!

on a humorous note, im always reminded of why moderation is good. the bouncer at a bar i used to go to alot would always tell me.

"you know tom, i have some words of ahddvice for you (in his real socal gangster drawl)"

"yeah chino (like the jail. take his advice!!), whats that?"

"you wan know why i went to jail?"

"sure i guess.."

"ill tell you....smooking...drinkinggg. fffking..fightihng....."

"oh yeah, i think you've told me that one before....thanks...."

Gotta love the "you self-righteous blah blah" comments. A personal decision not to drink is just that, personal. Who cares if someone else does or does not as long as it doesn't impact you. So why must posts or stories claiming the PERSONAL benefits derived from abstinence be characterized as "self-righteous??" Are drinkers really so insecure that they care about others' rationale for not drinking??

Oh, and FYI for a lot of folks who have had problems with alcohol there is nothing self-righteous about being on the wagon. Frankly criticizing people's personal decision and struggle as "self-righteous" is an exceptionally lousy thing to do. They have walked in your shoes drinkers so maybe save the critical labeling until you have truly struggled in theirs....

Amen Brother! There is nothing worse the an ex-drinker, ex-smoker etc. Control your sh_t, if you cannot you have bigger issues ...........

The program works if you work it.... or something .....

Rehab is for quitters.....