ovoleg

Ahh, usually I dont want to disrupt the other guy, especially if hes in the mode. Sometimes I say "passing" and then say good morning as I get next to the guy and usually they mumble back or look me like I am a jerk. I only pass if the guy is much slower otherwise I'll stay about 6-10 feet back and try to keep a good pace. It just seems weird when I cant catch up but I am in the drafting area, maybe they get pissed, maybe not. I know one guy had a mirror on his handlebar and I could see him eyeing mee constantly. As soon as I sped up to pass him, he started speeding up...I just let off and kept riding my pace till I lost him through a red light

baj32161

Jeez, I don't understand what all the fuss is about. If someone is drafting off of you, and riding in a responsible manner, what difference does it make to you. If you were out solo on a training ride what effect does it have on you to have someone on your wheel? It doesn't affect your effort or your aerodynamics. I would love to have someone draft off of me. It may even give me a chance to meet another cyclist. You guys are NOT leading a paceline up the Tourmalet or anything even like that. You don't own the section of road you're on. I love this sport but some of the "etiquette" just rubs me the wrong way. Do you do the same thing when someone is walking behind you? Some of you really need to get over yourselves.

I wouldn't mind drafting off of someone but I can never catch them in the first place.

Chucklehead

personally, i never use the draft of people i don't know. to me, it's all about respecting someone else's personal space. not everyone likes being stalked. i'd rather hang back or just pass them if i can. i don't mind if people draft me, but imagine if you were out running by yourself and some random person suddenly starts running really close behind you. that's not a comfortable feeling, is it?

alot of people pose the "what if they don't know what they're doing" question. i think these are mainly just the elitist f-nuts we all love to hate. i've been riding for two decades, and i don't pretend to know any more than the next guy about cycling.
i've been to several competitive driving academies, but that doesn't mean i might not cause an accident on the road someday.

Old Gammy Leg

This topic always comes up.

I *never* let strangers draft me, and I never draft people I don't know. If someone tries it I shout "don't ride up my a$$", and if they carry on I pull over and let them past.

It has nothing to do with free pulls or anything like that. It is purely a safety issue. There is almost always traffic around, I ride pretty fast, and I do not want some complete stranger sat 6" off my wheel. Maybe they're very proficient and maybe they're not - in that situation I do not particularly care to find out. It only takes one wheel touch to send us both flying, possibly under the wheels of a truck or at least into the deck at over 20mph.

Similarly, if coming up behind someone, I either hang 10 feet back, or overtake smoothly - one or the other.

This also has nothing to do with being an unfriendly, arrogant roadie. I am a very friendly cyclist, but sneaking up annanounced on someones wheel and causing a safety hazard is not a great way to start out.

kefin

That's how I feel. I don't suck on people's wheels if I don't know them. But in the very infrequent situations where I do sit on the back wheel of someone else (like when everyone's going up a long hill with steep narrow switchbacks like we have here in Northern Cal.), I always try to be polite *first* by pulling up beside the person and say something like, "Do you mind if I ride along?" or "Do you mind if I hang on a bit?" In every situation the response has been, "Oh, not at all!" I also try to do my part to pull when it's my turn, and respond in the same manner that people have treated me.

I would have a problem, though, if someone just sucked on my wheel and never said a single word, just so they can use me for their own purposes -- this happened to me just a few weeks ago and I thought the guy doing that had no sense of courtesy.

Just my 2 pennies... I'm sure there are plenty of folks who don't think this way.

-Kevin

baj32161

The out and out arrogance is astounding.

Old Gammy Leg

Where?

EventServices

The ettiquette that rubs you the wrong way is usually rooted in personal safety. Though you think you're perfectly harmless by hopping on my wheel unannounced, you're a menace to BOTH our safety.

I don't know you're back there.
I might slow down because sometimes I do that.
You're not paying attention.
Or maybe I swerve to avoid a pothole.
You take out my rear derailleur. Or get your skewer into my spokes.
One of us ends up in hospital just because you wanted to get your nose out of the wind.
I'm not here to protect you from a headwind.
My rear wheel is $500. My ribs are much more than that.
Until I know you, I'll be arrogant.

Stop taking it personally. It's a safety issue.

Phantoj

In 1969, many 19-year-olds found it annoying...

FatguyRacer

I do and dont mind it all at the same time. I dont mind it because its no big deal to me. I just ask that they at least say hello. For some reason that just peeves me off. Even when im being passed out on the road. At least say Hi. On the other hand, it sometimes makes me forget my training scheme for the day and i ride harder than i should have been, especially if the person takes a pull.

I actully find this more annoying than not. It makes me feel like im being stalked. I'd prefer people to draft properly. 5-6 feet away is not drafting, its following. I'd prefer a drafter to get on my wheel and share the work.

filtersweep

This post is obviously a joke.

'nother

I've had this happen before and it can be interesting or annoying. If the person knows I'm there and doesn't wave you around or slow down or start swerving or something to indicate they don't want me there, I'll stay if the pace is tolerable. If they wave me off or otherwise indicate they don't want any hangers-on, I'll pass. But I've had it happen that I've passed people like that, then they speed up and pass me again. ^$#%@#$%@ grumble grumble. WTF is that about? I don't get it, they don't want to be followed, don't want to be passed -- guess they just want the road to themselves. In that case the best thing is probably to just back waaaaayy off, let them get far ahead and hope you don't catch them again. Or, store up some gumption and pass with authority.

'nother

Someone managing to get a skewer into your spokes or take out your RD from 3-5 feet off your rear wheel would be pretty amazing. Or how some unknown's presence from that distance would cause you to crash as you swerve to avoid a pothole.

At 3-5 inches, okay (maybe), that point has been made repeatedly in the hundreds of other threads on this topic. But at 3-5 feet, the OP is really talking about following not so much drafting. And I *really* don't see what people's beef is with that.

OPC

Thank you. That's it exactly. It is common courtesy to ask before you get that close to another human being, on a bike or not.

I disagree. What the original poster was doing is stalking, not following. Un-announced, un-invited pursuit when the other rider moves to create some distance is intentional disrespect of the other rider's personal space. Back off or pass.

Everyone has different comfort zones and they let you know what they are in different ways. What the OP did could have easily escalated into confrontation. No one wins, then.

Ferniefreeheels

I love drafting especially with a group. But I wouldn't just pull up behind someone unannounced, what if he hit the binders for whatever reason not knowing someone was on his back wheel. I have caught up with a group before and asked if I could join them, taking my turn in the front as well.

Old Gammy Leg

To all those who don't mind being drafted close by complete strangers; or who actually consider it arrogant to object

- Do you really, honestly not think it's extremely dangerous to have a total unknown stranger inches off your wheel at over 20 mph with traffic around? Seriously?

Floorit

I once had this guy in front of me maybe half mile or so, slowly I caught him and then passed him up. Soon after I passed him, I notice he latched onto my back wheel. We traded back and forth for about ten miles and though we made casual eye contact once we finally parted ways, we ever said a single thing to each other.

Anyway I thought that was kind of cool, but normally if I ride solo I'm doing it to build endurance and for me drafting defeats that purpose.

'nother

Depends on one's culture and upbringing, really. I know a lot of close talkers who have no trouble getting right up in my face. They're not being rude; it's just how they learned. It's a bit uncomfortable at first, but there's no safety issue. Unless they have halitosis, ecch.


Eh. Stalking, following, whatever. On a privately-owned street I might concur with the stalking analysis, but on public roads . . . no different than me following you down the street if we were walking and happened to be going to the same place at about the same pace. At least we agree that at that distance there's no possibility of the follower/stalker's skewer going into the front rider's $500 wheel or priceless ribs, right?

'nother

Did you really, honestly read the OP where it said 3-5 feet at 16-17 mph?

Yo-

So I take it people don't like being drafted because of 2 reasons.

1. Safety
2. Don't like people freeloading off of them


1. It doesn't take a professional cyclist to be able to draft behind someone 3-5 feet and not hit the other rider's wheel. 7 year olds follow their parents without any problems. The person in the most danger is the rider doing the drafting. In fact doing the left and right swerving to lose the drafter is even more dangerous. Let me go one step ahead of this. I would say drafting this guy 3-5 feet behind him is even more safe than passing this guy on the road. There's even more danger in passing a fellow cyclist on the road. So if you get peeved by drafters becaue of safety, than you should be even more peeved by cyclists that pass you.

2. If I draft a better rider that makes my avg. speed higher and he wants me to give, than I'll be happy to give. But he was doing 24mph by himself. If I pull, I'll drop to 20mph. I'm not going to tell some stranger, "Hey, let me take a pull" and he drops behind me and we drop to 20mph. That's just stupid.

Now if I'm stronger than the rider in front and take his draft for a while, I'll be happy to give him my draft when I pull out ahead if he can keep up. But I don't know him, so I won't cater my riding to him. If he can't keep up, I won't slow down to "repay" him. Likewise, if I can't keep up with some one that was drafting me, I won't expect him to slow down so I can get "repayment."

uxrider

I find a well aimed snot rocket tends to get them to back off my wheel!

Cromulent

I don't think the issue is being a stranger... at least not for me. I haven't met most riders out there and a lot of people have great bike handling skills. And I like working with people I don't know. It's fun.

But if you're going to draft off my wheel, at least say 'hi'. I'll pull all day if you're not up to it. I'll go back to the team car for snacks if you want. But just don't sneak up on me... that's kinda creepy.

OPC

Yes, we can agree that crashing isn't the issue at 3+ feet. However, there is no divine right to chase someone on the road, public or not. If you were out for a walk and came across another walker, would you drop in 3 or 4 feet behind them and follow them? If they broke into a jog with the obvious intention of creating some distance, do you shadow them? What do you tell the police when they ask you why you were chasing them? Or why you got maced?

'nother

A guy was once telling me about how he pretended to have "a bug in his mouth" and was "rinsing it out" with his water/gatorade when an undesired follower/drafter persisted. Nice and safe

'nother

OK, that is good because it refutes the notion that most people continually bring up. And again, at shorter distances there may be a point but we already have plenty of threads on that.

There are no laws prohibiting following someone at 3 or 4 feet or even less. And, I imagine that most people walking, if they did not want to be followed, would simply stop in at a shop or something. Not try to have a dick-swinging contest or blow snot balls on the person following them or something. If someone maced me simply for "following too close", I think they would have some explaining in a courtroom; that's assault (on me).