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Huffy + Campagnolo Super Record = The Ultimate C&V Sacrilege build

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Huffy + Campagnolo Super Record = The Ultimate C&V Sacrilege build

Old 05-30-23, 09:49 PM
  #1576  
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Okay, photo dump coming! I'm uploading all the photos and there are a ton.

PURISTS BEWARE
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Old 05-30-23, 11:07 PM
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MEGA UPDATE Part I: The Rear Derailleur Stop


If you recall, here is where we last left off:



We got things roughed out, yet it was still very crude. Good news is that we had something workable, and I was able to get the split clamp design threaded, which took a bit of thinking (uh oh) because on one side I had to have clearance for the bolt head and the threaded part to slip down past, but on the on the other side, I had to have a smaller diameter for the tap to bite into to create the threads. Fortunately I didn't destroy anything (whaaat?!) and we were able to keep going.

Now, here was out problem:



Noticed out I used 'our' ? Yes, it's your problem too

Now, we had to clear that smooshed part of the dropout, and so the slot needed to be opened up a bit more. I didn't really take any measurements, I just kept filing a bit at a time...




Whew! Okay, we're on. Now the next problem...


Uh, how do I get around the 'semi-smooshed' part? Turns out this was the trickiest bit, because it is an awkward shape that isn't really flat, and isn't really round, and I didn't know how to account for it.

So I started relieving a channel and sort of chamfering the corners at the bottom of the split in hopes that I would get enough clearance...



Now, the last thing I wanted was to finally get this thing on, but have it be way too tight on the chainstay, and have it hang up on the OD, thinking that it was still that 'semi-smooshed' clearance problem and end up taking off metal in the wrong places, so I decided to measure again, just to be safe. Boy, I'm glad I did...




In one of my previous posts, I had measured the chainstay somewhere around .661 or .662 or thereabouts. The drill bit got us to within about 10-15 thous, so I was thinking I was going to need to open her up a bit. From the photo above, we are measuring .647 or so.

Well, you know what they say...measure 2x, cut 1x...





Whoa. What's up with that? Apparently on Huffys, if you move your caliper up or down 1/2", the measurement will all of the sudden change by several hundredths of an inch. Oh!, also, you need to measure both side-to-side, and top-to-bottom (as illustrated above), because you will get different measurements! Time to avg it out haha. So somehow it came out to LESS that the hole that I drilled, instead of MORE than. The good news is that it was within about 5-10 thous on avg, just slightly larger, which was good, because that will help us get this thing on.


The relief channel I cut into the top of the stop to aid in the install
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Old 05-30-23, 11:23 PM
  #1578  
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I figure if I'm going to get this thing on, I'm going to have one shot at it (without either wrecking the part or the paint), so I want it to look *choice* by the time it goes on. By the way, at this point, it still doesn't fit on there.




The most concerning part was this little drilled divot in the side - that was going to make for the thinnest spot - but it ended up being the best thing, because by the time I got it out, I decided to thin the rest of it out to that same dimension, which would allow enough 'spring' in it to hopefully overcome the ovalized part of the chainstay. ..





Almost gone...



Now, time to start rounding it out...








I decided to relieve the metal between the clamp and the stop, simply because I wanted the same universal 'thinness' over as much of the clamp as I could get, to avoid any concetrated stressors. I learned my lesson from those silly Campy clamps - which cracked and bent at the thinnest/weakest part. My hope was to avoid that.
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Old 05-30-23, 11:27 PM
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For spending 8+ hours on this little tiny part, I'm glad it at least looks the part







Now, mind you, at this point it was still an interference fit, and I had no idea if it was going to go on or not. I wasn't sure if I was going to bend/break the stop, marr the paint on the frame, or something else. I had the idea to grease up the chainstay, and ram it on and hope it worked. I even brought the tub of grease in the house to do it haha. But then I had a better idea - I cut a little 3" wedge for the split where the bolt goes, and once the stop was resting on the dropout pinch area, I slowly started wiggling that little wedge into the split, and opened it up just enough, and whala!











Polished the paint, located it about 4" away from the axle (eyeballed it really), and cinched it down tight. No threads stripped, nothing cracked, no paint loss. I'm a happy camper!

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Old 05-30-23, 11:37 PM
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Originally Posted by AdventureManCO
For spending 8+ hours on this little tiny part, I'm glad it at least looks the part

Polished the paint, located it about 4" away from the axle (eyeballed it really), and cinched it down tight. No threads strips, nothing cracked, no paint loss. I'm a happy camper!
Apart from the obviously impressive handiwork of a certain Tiger, this is one ugly and sketchy looking dropout-"connection". This looks like it would snap from leaning it against a wall.
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Old 05-30-23, 11:43 PM
  #1581  
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MEGA UPDATE Part II: The Bar Wrap

I got some great consultation from the Dude of Drillium, who had some great advice - leave the brake lever clamp rings on the bar, and wrap around those. That way we won't have any unsightly gaps.

For the bars, I'm trying to match the leather Brooks saddle (at least in spirit) and going w/ a thin 1-2oz solid, genuine veg tan leather. It is completely natural, so not dyed at all, so it won't match the saddle anytime soon, but will eventually, and should beautify with age. I should point out that hardly anyone does this, because it is a lot of work, but! I was able to purchase a 3" strip of leather, I think 84" long, for like $25-$30, then I cut it in half, and bam! I had two genuine leather bar wraps. So no need for the big bucks to go real leather, although buying something that is nearly ready to go, like that super nice perfortated stuff for a thousand dollers is a good way to go, but we DIY over here fam. Gotta do it from scratch. Built, not bought!

Now, I know this works, because I had this leather bar wrap on my Raleigh Super Course for a while while it had drop bars, but I had taken those off, and the leather strips were just bouncing around my junk boxes for a few years. I'm actually surprised I found not only them, but the little backing strips to go behind the brake levers as well.

I skived the other 3 sides of the back of the leather strips, and boy oh boy that sucked. I cut myself so many times I ended up taking my razor blade out to the garage and rounded off the tip on my grinding wheel to stop stabbing myself. The Le Grande definitely drew blood today. But I won.


Soaking the leather in preparation -





Some may argue against this, but here is why I did it. The leather had already taken a bit of a 'set' from it's previous installation on the Super Course, so while that was helpful for orienting the leather wrap in the right direction (I liked how I did it on the SC), it wouldn't have allowed for a tight wrap. Wetting it down made it much more pliable and able to be formed to it's new wrap...






I decided to go bottom-to-top, and wrap in a counter-clockwise direciton on the left, and a clockwise direction on the right.




This is the little leather back piece that goes behind the brake levers -




As such -




Now, one of the trickier parts (besides how to terminate or tie-off) is the bar ends. This stuff is less forgiving than cotton or foam. For plugs, I really had to muscle them on, and even had to relieve one a bit for one to stay on. But in the end they stayed on -



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Old 05-30-23, 11:51 PM
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Now, how about for that top end...




I decided to try a two-part attachment method. First was using some 3M sticky spray stuff...




That seemed to hold it well on its own, so that's good. Now, onto my favorite was to secure something like a leather bar wrap - waxed thread for leather stitching!


This is 'Ritza Tiger' thread, which is some of the best stuff you can get for saddle-stitching. It will do the job nicely here.

I first put a little loop in the thread on the end of the wrap, then go over the bars with it and start wrapping over the loop...



And keep going...



And keep going until you have just a little tiny opening of the loop left...




Then you thread your loose end (the end you've been wrapping with) through that little hole...




...then on the other end (the short one), take some pliers and firmly but gently start pulling that loop closed...




The closing of the loop draws in the end you just threaded through it, and it is now neatly tucked under the wrap.



Cut your ends and you are done.

Looks great, right?





Right?
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Old 05-30-23, 11:56 PM
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NO! Just look at that. Looks terrible!!!

The leather end isn't even perpendicular to the bar, and the thread wrap is super fat, and it is tied of RIGHT where it is most visible. Bah!

Yeah, I'm redoing that!




I undid the string, undid the end of the wrap, cut it after marking it straight, then decided to retie it, but lower where it won't be so visible...






Oh, pro tip. If you are using electrical tape to hold your super fancy leather bar wrap before you tie it so it doesn't unwind, don't stick it to your super fancy saddle as a placeholder



Whoopsie!


Now it's time to install the levers, and look - no gaps! They look great on there. Hoods...those will be coming. Just wait.



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Old 05-31-23, 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by gaucho777
Looking forward to the updates--and ride reports in due time. Dare I ask for rough accounting of time and funds invested?
Way back near the beginning of this despicably sacrilegious exercise, The Perpetrator declared that there was no budget, which caused pretty much all of us other folk to assume that there was no limit on the amount of his (not really) funds that we could have him try to get by the resident CFO/CEO. In other words, it is CLASSIFIED - TOP SECRET - IDISFO
(Iím Dead If She Finds Out!!).
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Old 05-31-23, 12:12 AM
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MEGA UPDATE Part III: The Brakes and Sticky Time!

I didn't get a lot of pictures of installing the brake housing and cables because, well, we all know how to sort of do that, and it would just needlessly fill the bandwidth. Although, thats all I've been doing for 3 months now.

But a few things to note. I used ultralight compressionless housing, and the stuff is awesome. I would cut it, then grind the ends completely flat, then open up the ends for clearance with an awl.



Sorry, out of focus, but you get the idea. Grind flat, then open up.





While I was at it, I decided that since mechanicals were pretty much sorted, it was finally time to have a little fun with some stickers!






I haven't yet decided if my cable loops are too big or not. I tried to get them nearly the same size/height, but the front brake cable might just be a tad higher. If so, we will correct that.


Here is a little taste of victory for Mad Honk and stoneageyosh






Funny thing about that little Campy sticker. So, I had gotten used to these 'transfer' style stickers, since I had never used them before, and that's all that I had up till this point. So I put this little 'Campagnolo Equipped' sticker on the chain stay, then started peeling off the clear part, when it dawned on me...'oh, you are peeling up the sticker. Don't do that'


We also needed to absolutely make sure our bike had the WORLD CHAMPION stripes on it. You know, Dave Stohler and all.






And since 'Le Grandpagnolo' was one of the first nicknames of the bike, I wanted to have some fun and get nostalgic.




Now, you may notice that there are only two cable guides on that top tube, and that is because I didn't want to ruin the beautiful lines of our Huffy model name. I suppose I can add the 3rd in the middle, but it just seems so much more crisp not having one interrupt the wording.
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Old 05-31-23, 12:37 AM
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MEGA UPDATE Part IV: The first ride, and impressions

So, I need to let everyone know that I now have the nicest riding Huffy in the entire world, period. And no, I'm not at all considering all those 'Faux-rotta' 7-Eleven bikes out there that aren't even real Huffys that just crack and bre...actually let's not talk about cracking Huffys, shall we?


So, I hopped on the bike tonight around 9:30pm or so, and had no idea what to expect. I 'sort of' checked my derailleur limit stops, gave the tires an extra topping off, and off we went.



Wow. Just...wow. It rode like a million bucks which, ironically, is about the cost of the bike, the parts, and all my therapy sessions during the build.

I took my hands off the bars...the bike no longer tried to violently throw me off. It rode straight and true, and dare I say, 'nimbly', like it wouldn't put up with me letting my mind wander - it wanted my attention and NOW. That type of steering. The kind that is not twitchy, but wants you to focus on riding the bike and steering...why, just like a race bike!!

I'm being a bit facetious, but legit, the bike is totally transformed. I haven't weighed it yet, but the slim fast diet worked, folks. And, we still have plenty we can lose! I can't wait to ride it more. I actually want to ride it. It was still comfy from that long wheelbase and shorter stem, and did exactly what I wanted or needed it to do. And that Regina Oro sounds sweet...it sounds expensive! You feel like you're on the bike equivalent of a Lamborghini, but you are on a Huffy. It is surreal, and hilarious. And I'll take it. I'm going to have so much fun with this thing, and it is going to blow people's minds, guaranteed. ESPECIALLY if they ride it.


View from the front


Now.. there are a few things to still sort out, and I'll have some further updates on:

1. I was planning to dish the rear wheel just a skosh to center in the rear, but I found about 3-4 stripped spoke nipples. I did the best I could, and readjusted the brakes, so everything works, but you can tell its slightly off. Not sure the best approach to that. It seems like tension on the rear wheel is all over the place, and some of the tightest spokes are the ones that need to move the most to true the rim, which I don't get. I'm open to ideas there.

2. The pedal cages - this is exciting and worthy of it's own post, which it will get, just not tonight.

3. The brake cable housing loop sweep/height - good/bad/?

4. Brake hoods - update to come on that soon

Lastly, I've got a few huge reveals that you will need to wait a couple days more for. But I promise you they will be absolutely worth it. You ain't seen nothin' yet.


Thank you to ALL of you who have been following along, entertained, amused, befuddled, frustrated, shocked, horrified, and offended. And a HUGE thank you to all of you that have supported this project in some way, shape, or form. You know who you are, I know who you are. Thank you.

This is not the end - rather, just the beginning, and there is going to be a lot more to come, but so much happened over the last couple of days that we needed a moment just to sort it all out and see where we stand. And where we stand is that we now have a cheap, junky Huffy built up with legit Campagnolo Super Record parts that cost 100x what the bike is worth by itself and so far, its freakin' awesome.

Keep watching this space for some amazing updates throughout the week, and the of course, the big event, which is both this coming Saturday and Sunday. There will be a 66mi ride on Saturday, call the Randonee Heroica, followed by a 'vintage bike geek fest' at a local shop dedicated to classic road bikes, and the the main event on Sunday, which will be a 35+ mile ride and concours event.

I'm looking forward to all of it.

Have a good night y'all!
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Old 05-31-23, 12:42 AM
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This is what my heretical threads dream about being, but shall never achieve, which is water off a duck's back in a pond, er, I mean, great! Far and away the most fun and magical build thread, IMO. The premise, the progress shown via photos, the commentary on the progress (including replies!), the post count (which is still counting!)--this was/is the whole package! Bravo, sir!

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Old 05-31-23, 12:47 AM
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Originally Posted by gaucho777
Dare I ask for rough accounting of time and funds invested?

You know, the wife actually asked for this as well this evening.

Truth is I have no idea, but it might be an interesting/painful/tortuous excercise that I'm sure would be fun and hilarious for everyone but me, so of course we will do it.
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Old 05-31-23, 01:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Positron400
Apart from the obviously impressive handiwork of a certain Tiger, this is one ugly and sketchy looking dropout-"connection". This looks like it would snap from leaning it against a wall.
The cable stop/guide did come out nice. One could almost say that it makes up for the double yugly stay end that appears to have possibly been simultaneously stomped and spot welded.
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Old 05-31-23, 01:46 AM
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So it only took 60 pages and three months to complete..
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Old 05-31-23, 03:39 AM
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Nice!

And here I am, thinking about changing a cassette here and there, some brakepads maybe (all on my own bikes)... Thinking it might be 'too much work', or 'maybe not now, it can wait a few days right?'
You Sir, are an example to us all. That with enough hard headedness, a 'decent*' set of skills and some** encouragement you will get far.
And fabricate a really decent ride out of really decent stuff. On average. Not that this bike is anything like average..!

Much respect, and I for one cant wait to see more photos of the bike and the ride upcoming weekend.

Ride on!

* - More than decent. Skilled to the max! Coupled with a lot of paitence. I mean, how long before you got a decent rear derailler cable stop ...
** - Like someone above me said earlier: really liked the comments , and the comments on that, etc. etc. You really got by with a little help from your friends.
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Old 05-31-23, 04:49 AM
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Looks absolutely great. Kudos.

Glad your original chainstay stop worked without re-do and that my concerns indeed ended up a "what if" drill for an issue that didn't manifest.

I'd be very interested in knowing the bike's "ready for long ride/concourse" weight - e.g., after brake hoods/toe clips/toe straps (if you're using full clips vice half-clips) and bottle cage are added.




Again: damn nice work. Congrats.

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Old 05-31-23, 06:21 AM
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Reading this was like watching the final episode of a favorite TV series. I didn't want it to end. Like they say on all the stupid Motortrend TV shows I watch; "bro, you knocked it out of the park!"
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Old 05-31-23, 07:00 AM
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@AdventureManCO you said earlier about the RD cable stop; "...because it is an awkward shape that isn't really flat, and isn't really round, and I didn't know how to account for it."

It's called an "oval" and more precisely, an "irregular oval."
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Old 05-31-23, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by RB1-luvr
Reading this was like watching the final episode of a favorite TV series. I didn't want it to end. Like they say on all the stupid Motortrend TV shows I watch; "bro, you knocked it out of the park!"
Hopefully season 2 isn't a huge letdown! Although let's be honest, they always are.


Originally Posted by Germany_chris
So it only took 60 pages and three months to complete..


Not complete...I mean, we're not even at 2000 posts yet!
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Old 05-31-23, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh
@AdventureManCO you said earlier about the RD cable stop; "...because it is an awkward shape that isn't really flat, and isn't really round, and I didn't know how to account for it."

It's called an "oval" and more precisely, an "irregular oval."
I missed the 'Introduction to the Oval' lesson in geometry class that day
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Old 05-31-23, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Hondo6
Looks absolutely great. Kudos.

Glad your original chainstay stop worked without re-do and that my concerns indeed ended up a "what if" drill for an issue that didn't manifest.

I'd be very interested in knowing the bike's "ready for long ride/concourse" weight - e.g., after brake hoods/toe clips/toe straps (if you're using full clips vice half-clips) and bottle cage are added.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8O_UIsdZHA


Again: damn nice work. Congrats.
Thank you for your kind comments, and...you haven't even seen the best of it, which isn't my handiwork. All will be revealed soon!
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Old 05-31-23, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by stoneageyosh
The cable stop/guide did come out nice. One could almost say that it makes up for the double yugly stay end that appears to have possibly been simultaneously stomped and spot welded.
The derailleur cable tension should keep everything together for a while...
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Old 05-31-23, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Millstone
You really got by with a little help from your friends.

This right here is where it's at folks. Looking back now, I had no idea what I was in for. A lot of pain, problems, and counseling.

But - the kind generosity of this community took pity on my hapless endeavor and decided to jump in on the barn-raising. I cannot recount it all here (for anonymity's sake) but it has been more than you know about. And I can't thank you all enough. That's really where the kudos lies, not in the bike, or in my efforts to modify it and subsequently redoing half of what I already did
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Old 05-31-23, 10:27 AM
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This well-developed project is truly a lesson in time/cost-no-object perseverence, which I'm sure has been therapeutic if you have anything like a "typical" day job.

I enjoyed seeing all of the obstacles overcome, one by one. The arrival of the brazing torches took it to the next level!

I'm really not surprised that it's a great-riding bike, especially if the frame dimensions fit you. I believe (based on my own measurements of 22- and 23-inch frames) that Huffy shared the time-proven geometry from Schwinn's electro-forged models, so how could it not ride well, comfortably so, once the saddle and handlebar cockpit are up to standards?

This thing is a rolling conversation piece.
I'm looking forward to the many photos that this project deserves, including (hopefully) the look on people's faces as they take in this bike during inspection.

I'm guessing at this bike weighing 27-28 pounds.

The right/rear brake cable would normally rest to the other side of the stem, but with such a short stem it might need to be tucked under the front brake's cable to stay there, and which might necessitate a bit of shortening of the front brake housing to equalize the loops(???)...

If the steering is twitchy it might only be because of a slow speed exacerbating the steering flop factor of the 70-degree HT angle, otherwise I would check the headset bearing tension with the front wheel removed or with the headtube held at 90-degrees (i.e. vertical) to discern any bearing drag.

Best wishes on your big weekend going well, hopefully you'll have time to get everything feeling fully sorted by then.

The spoke nipples need fixing, I have a few tricks I use to get them turning.
First is to lubricate them from both ends using your best penetrant, don't forget the rim-seating area which by itself can effect a LOT of torsional resistance to turning.
Allow said penetrant some time to work if possible.
Apply wrench torque using a slightly-undersized spoke wrench, in both directions. Then do the same on the other pair of flats. Repeat.

Failing the above attempts to get the nipple moving, apply a smooth-jawed Vice-Grip to a pair of flats, but slide it down to meet the rim first. Then squeeze, then twist, first in one direction and then the other. Repeat. Then move 90-degrees and squeeze the other pair of flats. Then twist back and forth again This ovalizes the threaded bore, allowing the threads to free up and the penetrant to migrate.
The idea here is not to exceed the torsional strength of the spoke with any one twist.

Lastly, apply a pencil-point torch tip to the nipple, but not to the spoke which might lose it's temper. Then quickly apply wrench or Vice-Grip torque to one set of flats and then to the other. Again, this works the bore of the nipple a bit, allowing the corrosive bond to break.

A spoke nipple that has damaged flats can be turned using a well-fitting screwdriver blade, in concert with whatever wrench torque can be applied to the damaged flats. A Vice-Grip often offers some last-resort grip and torque on a damaged nipple.
Be sure to have some spare nipples handy with the exact same wrench-size (Japanese, Euro, DT in descending size order), and replace any bad ones. I forced (sliding action toward the rim) the Green "Euro" wrench onto the Japanese spoke nipples yesterday, with good results.
An ovalized spoke nipple can still have torque applied using the other set of flats, or the original set of flats when applying reverse-torque (assuming it was first damaged in the tightening direction).

Lastly, before adjusting any damaged or heavily-tight spoke, always first check what's going on with it's neighboring spokes on the same side of the wheel, using comparative spoke-plucking tone (with a finger held against any crossing/touching spoke to damp it's also ringing). Also check the two closest opposite-side spokes for their comparative tension along that side of the wheel. The spoke tension uniformity should thus only improve as a wheel is dished and trued (an efficient builder is thus making the rim run truer and the spoke tensions more uniform at the same time).

I spent some hours over the last couple of days fighting with having to re-dish an old, weathered rear wheel and a mis-dished front wheel. A lotta time spent on those two wheels so it's still all-too-fresh in my recollections!

Last edited by dddd; 05-31-23 at 11:49 AM.
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