Today I did my longest solo ride to date. 80 miles one way, which took me 6:40 moving time or 7:06 total time.

What was really weird and I'm hoping people can help me with was what happened after about 60 miles. When I was climbing, even relatively gentle hills, I was aware of what I'd describe as pre-cramp trembles on my upper legs, slightly above the knee and on the inside. Curiously they only happened when I was raising the leg, not when I was pressing on the pedals. On the flats I could still maintain 20mph despite the headwind but even a gentle gradient and they came right back.

I suspect I needed to take on more food and water earlier on, but never had anything like that happen before.

I also found that I was getting cramps in my quads when climbing but I could get off the bike, take a few steps off the bike, then get back on and carry on.

So what I've discovered today is that my endurance isn't as good as I hoped it would be (at least not maintaining a decent speed), and my legs do weird things under conditions they never faced before.

If anyone can give me some pointers what might be going on I'd be interested to know!

Spin more.

most of my cramping problems are solved short-term by eating. Long-term, training helps. Walking does help, I have found that many times. Particularly when I wear out the muscles in my lower back

Can't help you there. I experienced the same thing in my calves yesterday on a bit shorter ride. I thought it got better with water and Nuun.

Although there have been some recent articles indicating that hydration and cramping are not related, I have a lot of personal experience that suggests they are.

When I don't drink enough during the day, my feet will cramp in the evening ... whether I'm exerting myself or not. And there seems to be a strong relation between not drinking enough while riding and my quad or calf cramps.

So first of all, I would suggest that you make sure you are well hydrated. The general recommendation is one 750 ml bottle every 1 to 1.5 hours, depending on weather, exertion, etc.

A couple other possible causes of cramps include:

-- lack of fitness ... if you are exerting yourself more than you are used to, you may cramp.

-- lack of electrolytes. Don't forget to consume foods with electrolytes in them and/or take electrolyte tablets, especially on hot days.

I would say you need to experiment with getting more electrolytes. For rides 50-100+ I take 1 or more bottles of hammer drinks. For rides 100-200 miles, I take Hammer enduralyte tablets too. I used those tablets on a big climb as well, such as Mt Lemmon in Tucson (23 miles of 5-6% grade).

Yeah, pretty simple. You got tired. It happens. Solution: more long rides and more weekly mileage total. Sure, watch what you eat and drink and electrolytes. But it's really all about the riding. Danny Chew rode 170 miles without eating or drinking anything. I believe Pete Penseyres did the same for considerably further. 6:40 saddle time says you need to ride more. Keep at it and keep it a consistent part of your life, year 'round.

Looking back in the light of what people are saying I think the primary issue was electrolytes, coupled with the fact it was the furthest I'd done solo and the furthest I'd done at any meaningful speed. I've done 80+ miles in a day before but always at a much more leisurely pace. So a need to improve my fitness will also be in there somewhere too.

Looks like more longer rides are needed... I know I'd need to do more rides but was surprised at the way my legs were responding to the hills.

And to the exhausted randonneur, many brevet routes seem to have been concocted by sadistic devils, with 18% climbs late in the route. So yeah, include more hills in your long rides, but ride them easy for the first 2-3 months. Try to ride them at a level that doesn't hurt. After your conditioning is good, start riding the later ones at a level that does hurt. Try for at least 50' of climbing per mile, averaged over the route.

Since starting the long trail back into LD cycling, I have suffered the same types of cramps. Hydration plays a role, but I think that truly it is a matter of getting the miles into your legs. These cramps are coming from exertion by muscles over and over again when they aren't used to it. Climbing does exacerbate the problem, in my experience.

My remedies have been to ride more, pay more attention to rehydration (which is easier said than done) and take electrolyte tabs regularly (or at least salty foods such as crisps/chips).

I have finished rides dehydrated, but the onset of cramps has been held at bay, or at least the twinges have started but not developed into fully-fledged cramps, so riding more under stress (as in at a faster speed or higher gear up hills) does seem to be effective.

I remember one ride when we were returning that had a nasty hill on it. My rehydration routines had gone out the window, I was overdressed (ie, overheated), and by the time we got to the hill, I was ready to call it quits. I walked the hill, tried getting back on the bike, then was paralysed on the roadside for five minutes by a charlie horse cramp that was excruciating. And there was nothing I could do to stop it! It happened several more times... as Machka rode off into the distance oblivious to what was happening. In the end, we ran out of time for the next control, spent an hour or more sitting at a petrol station consuming Coke and chips, then made our way to the finish.

Unfortunately, the cramps were so bad, that the muscle was sore for more than a week afterwards. Now if I feel a twinge, I am very very careful about rehydrating, salt intake, and easing off on the pedal pressure. Sometimes, I will be sitting in a chair at home, go to get up and have the cramp; and climbing into and out of a small tent can be an interesting experience when those muscles decide they don't want to work anymore.

My test is always: can I change clothes in the car after the ride without cramping? I even have special easy-to-get-into pants and socks.

Last summer, I rode a 400Km that started at 8pm. About 300Km into the ride, in the late afternoon after riding for hours at around 95 F, my friend and I took a nap in a churchyard. After half on hour when I tried to get up, I rolled to my right and instantly went into a full-leg cramp in my right leg. I tried to shake it out while lying flat on my back and waited for it to subside. Then I tried to roll to the left and instantly went into a full-leg cramp in my left leg. I rolled back onto my back like a beached whale, bag of electrolytes sitting in my handlebar bag fifteen feet away, and tried to figure out a way to get up that didn't actually require moving. Fortunately, my friend was up, so I had him pass me some Endurolytes, which I crunched up and washed down. Cramps were gone in a couple of minutes. I have no idea what I'd have done if I were on my own!

Nick

What confused me was that the first twinges were in my quads but only when I was lifting the pedal up. When I pressed down on the pedal it didn't twinge at all at that stage. I don't use clips so as the pedal rises the only effort my leg makes is to make sure my foot stays on the pedal, which isn't much.

Salty snacks need to go in my bag for next time. At my destination I felt badly out of sorts, like my mind was agitated but for no apparent reason, which at the time seemed very much like the beginnings of hypoglycaemia. So I ate a bowl of salted peanuts and felt better very soon afterwards. Either way I'm sure I needed more electrolytes in my system and probably more calories as well.

I'll have to try the higher gear up the hills next time. I want to do that ride again - I spent a long time planning the route so it didn't take in too many major roads. I never have a problem with expecting a driver to wait until he can pass me safely but I prefer to avoid roads where I'd be doing 15-20mph on a road where lots of cars would normally be doing 50-60 and where passing is difficult due to traffic volume. It was a good route all in, a couple of bits with dodgy road surface quality but on balance I'd do the same route again rather than rejigging it.

Ouch!

Truth be told what kept me going through the first cramps was that I wanted to make it to the 100k milestone (I'd done about 59 miles of the 62.1 when I got the first cramps) especially since it was so close. From there the next 20 miles had me periodically thinking I'd need to call for someone to come and get me but the desire to finish the ride overpowered the desire to quit. Then once the "distance to destination" field on my GPS dropped below 5 miles and I was on roads I know quite well it seemed easier, and it did feel good to ride down the final stretch on a road I haven't cycled since I was a teenager.

Small tent + cramps... not good!

One of my worst cramps occurred on a 100 km ride in January 2010.

I had developed DVT and lost all my fitness a few months earlier, and was building back up again.

That day was over 30C by 8 am ... and hit something in the 40s by the middle of the day.

The ride started with a long, long climb ... which I handled (but during which time I didn't drink much), and then it flattened a bit so that was OK. Then, during the hottest part of the day, we tackled the steepest climb of the route, about 3 km at about 12% (and again, I didn't drink much). By the time I reached the top, I was not feeling well at all. I had been under the impression that the route flattened after that, but it was rolling hills. I reached the next town, but I was dizzy, nauseated, and well into heat exhaustion.

Rowan and I rested a bit, drank a bit, and had a bit to eat ... and then we kept going, stopping every couple km so I could lie down on the side of the road and feel like I was going to die. And then my quads started to cramp mildly.

At one point Rowan cycled off ahead a little way, on the way up another hill, and of course my quads chose that moment to seize up entirely. I had managed to get off the bicycle just in the nick of time, and the only thing I could do was stand there. I couldn't walk. I couldn't get back on the bicycle. All I could do was stand.

So I'm standing there on the side of the road with my bicycle next to me, sipping water in the hopes that it will help, when all of a sudden a car pulls up and stops in front of me, and a young man hops out. "Oh lovely", I think, "Either this person is here to help ... or, if it is someone who is going to hassle me, I can't run away!!" But all he wanted was directions. I stood there, completely unable to move, and gave him directions to the next town. And then he drove off.

It was 5 or 10 minutes before I could start hobbling down the road.

Shortly after that, Rowan cycled off to get the van, and I walked several km to the next town. I could get on the bicycle and coast down hills, but there was no way I could ride up hills. I ended that day with 88 km.

All this talk about cramps! I've never cramped on the bike. Dehydrated, overhydrated, e-cap, no e-caps it doesn't seem to matter for me. I think there must be a genetic link in there somewhere or I made the right sacrifice to the cycling gods somewhere along the line.

Make sure you're properly hydrated, fed, and, um, electrolyted.

With those out of the way, try standing in the pedals on a few hills BEFORE you start to get that cramped feeling in your quads. Standing is the only way for me to get complete use from my inner quad muscle - which is the one that gives me grief on hills if I don't extend it completely. You don't have to hammer up the hills - just standing with a cadence maybe half your spin rate (e.g. 45ish if you spin @ 90). You'll probably have to shift to a harder gear when you stand.

Works for me. Might not for you... people are different.

Richard's advice is good. I hadn't really thought about it, but I stand a lot more nowadays to climb than I have in the past, and it does help overcome the susceptibility to cramping.

I think the fact that you ride a LOT means that the relevant muscles in that part of the leg have been trained and strengthened and have become used to the exertion. I think that's one of the key elements coming out of this thread -- ride more and get that muscle used to the job it's meant to be doing. Oh, and you're a really lucky rider to have avoided this pain from hell!!

I'll have to try the whole standing thing. As a teenager I stood on the pedals a lot to get more power down, as an adult it just doesn't feel very stable. I'm a lot heavier now than I was then, although the difference is slowly dropping. It's certainly worth a try.

Ride more... indeed! I think it's also time I started planning some of my routes specifically to take in the local hills. There aren't all that many to choose from so perhaps a route that takes them in multiple times might be required.

That probalby does help. I remember on my very first century I was climbing this 19% grade (at about 2mph) about 70 miles into the ride and came upon this group of people standing around this guy who was all bent over. I stopped and asked "did you loose a contact?" I asked because that's what it looked like but apparently he was just cramping so bad he couldn't stand up! Then I noticed all his blood vessles were sticking out and it looked like he was trying to lift 1000lbs. I rode off thinking, "man, I'm glad that isn't me!" That looked like no fun at all.