That's what I meant. I assumed you were referring to the
Yamaguchi-made US National team frames, and I figured
that since Lance was a US National star rider, that even
then he probably didn't foot the bill on his frame, but I
could be wrong.

MESSENGER CULTURE IS TEH SELL-OUT! OMG, LIKE OMG...WE ALL NEED TO FIND A NEW TREND TO JUMP ONTO NOW THAT NIKE IS SELLING US OUT.

OMG, like I just bought a new pista and a new messenger bag. I gotta sell it now. I've been sold out. Nike ruined riding a bike for me. I can't possibly ride a fixed gear because nike has spoiled it for me. OMG. THis sucks. Maybe SOAP shoes will be cool now. At least nike isn't involved with that.

blah...

I don't mean to pick on you, but there have been like 10 different responses exactly like this here.

No one is saying this.

People here, including myself, don't like Nike for a ****ing slew of reasons. They're one of the most visible, unrepentently inhumane trans-national corporations. Anyone who's been through college or has an even slightly critical perspective knows this. Add on top of this their "coolhunting," or co-opting of the alternative (the same "alternative" that often is opposing everything Nike stands for) and it makes perfect sense that people are a little upset with Nike.

It rubs me to see Nike moving in on our loose little subculture, but no one is acting like the strawman you people have been constructing.

who cares how many there have/haven't been?

it is a topic that recirculates, ad nauseum. no strawmen, just the reality that people LOVE to bring this crap up.

who ****ing cares. go ride your bikes

Roughly 80 responses (and 1,770 views!) in 3 hours on a pretty popular forum with many more on the way. This thread will most likely stay at the top for a while, barring a thread lock, keeping Nike on the minds of its readers. Who knows what else will pop up on other forums and blogs. Bad publicity, even neutral publicity, is good publicity, blah blah blah.

You don't need to launch an ad campaign to target a subculture. Just put up a billboard in a city most of us will never visit and let it grow on its own. I love it!

I don't mean to pick back at you...but don't you think that the outlandish tone of my post was obvious that I was playing it all up, based on reading through the thread?

I have no problem with Nike featuring fixies in adverts. Who really cares. It hurts nothing. Nike did the same with skateboarding years ago, failed badly on their first try....yet they tried again and now are cosnidered one of the "core" skate shoe brands in some circles. Nike makes a good product. Blah blah blah about sweatshops and such.

As for "coolhunting" Nike (and Target...and whoever) do it all the time. The advertising industry is based on it. It is the way it is. I doubt Nike or Target would run the track bike/sisngle speed adverts in bumble****, Iowa. I work accross the street from the giant target track bike advert in Times Square (for an advertising agency actually) and in the context of Times Square it works. It's cool and everyday I pass it I look up and smile. 90% of people who pass by it just see a guy on a bike and don't care.

The world runs on money. Who cares what company picks up on what. Does it change how much you like riding your fixie? If it does, you've got issues.

(on a personal note....I loath Nike's cycling products...but adore their running shoes....Though the advert seems to be selling lifestyle over anything)...

****ing well said!

I care

Is that okay?

F*ck anyone running sweatshops that pays 15 year old chinese girls less than a dollar a day and makes 'em work 12-18 hour days. but be apathetic and go snort some shoes...

buh? nike makes like 2 or 3 decent pairs of running shoes. the rest are selling to the "lifestyle" of the "fitness culture." i tried a pair of pegasus, and they felt like **** after wearing mizuno wave riders for so long.

at least it's not as bad as when nike did this


for those of you that missed it https://www.boingboing.net/2005/06/29...t_vs_nike.html

Sidi makes better cycling shoes....descente makes nicer jerseys and such....

But Air Structure Triax running shoes...rule!

Ha! I'm a sXe...I cut my teeth on Minor Threat in the 80s....I found that funny when I first saw it. Lame, but funny. I know Ian though the same.

npoak: of course I realize you were not being serious. You're making fun of some hypothetical knee-jerk reaction to this ad.

My point is that no one is saying that, and there is a perfectly well-reasoned position for disliking Nike.

Oh ya....those 15 year old chinese girls would be way better off spending 16 hours in a field making 20 cents a day. Oh wait...they would be SO better off being prostitutes. Ya, that's it. **** sweatshops....

Do you honestly think that if one of those 15 year old girls (kids) didn't have that job in the sweatshop...they would not work? They would sit at home listening to pop music talking to their friends on the phone and hanging out at the mall? Is your world view that simple? The reality as that in most of those places families are so poor that the kids work, generally they want too to help the family. Sweatshops suck, but they are better off there than on the street being hookers.

Well I'm glad. However most of the "well-reasoned" dislike for Nike in this thread isn't so well reasoned and it just empty rhetoric that seems to hold strong until you think about it and educate yourself some...

i think i'd rather be a hooker... wouldn't you?
yes my world view is that simple.

no, I wouldn't....

Hahahaha!

Exactly what npoak said is what I am so conflicted over. The first thought that comes to my mind is that I don't want to support unfair work conditions and an operation that is almost comparable with slavery. I would never want to be a part of that in a million years. However, then comes up the concern that without jobs, say they got closed down and everything, would life really be better for these people? Then I start feeling selfish because now I may be indirectly supporting the downfall of a family and their income by not buying these products.

It is something I think about a lot. I fear that without a mass renovation to a better system by powerful sources (which might also be dangerous, unless it is a set-in-stone just power), not supporting this ugly thing might be even worse. And I'm not really sure what to do about it.

So yea... it is hard for me when something of this nature comes up.

did i say hooker? i meant farmer.

the prob is supporting unfair labor practices in countries where it is illegal to strike and illegal to organize labor unions. besides that, it also puts hardship on the american manufacturers that are pressured to produce more cheaply, thus causeing them to move operations overseas, which means a loss of jobs over here in the states.

Bigger than life, no?

blah blah blah...we live in a global economy.

I'll spare you my rant on how evil labor unions and collectivism are. If you want to debate that PM me.....

You are entitled to your opinion....

Some opinions are more right than others. The fact is, npoak, that the free market sweatshop-defense arguments you're echoing have been ripped apart in countless peer-reviewed academic papers through the years. Working in an advertising agency in Times Square, it doesn't surprise me that this is news to you - you're personally invested, surrounded by an ad culture that needs to justify it's role in the global economy.

It's pretty ironic that you've been calling what I'm saying "empty rhetoric" and accusing me of having a "simple worldview." My "opinions" about sweatshops are based on an academic (near)consensus - what are yours?

I like your photos. who did the ad? w+k?

and riding brakeless in japan isn't so bad. everything is so flat. and cars are use to having mama-chari everywhere.

i miss japan.

Dude, we've most likely read the same "academic papers". We just seem to disagree on the meaning of them. My company is in advertising, but I don't work in it...

There is a large amount of rhetoric written favoring each side of the argument here. You are going to believe whatever side favors your ideals/agenda at the total exclusion of the other.

Regardless, you are entitled to your opinion. If Nike offends you....don't buy their product. You control it with your money.