Spld cyclist

wphamilton,

It would be a big help if you could check out how the Samsung Centura works without cell turned on. That's one of the ones I was looking at, and the manual is vague about whether that will work or not. Also, it's good to know that about SD vs. internal memory. Do you use the Centura with sensors?

njkayaker

Complete waste of money for what you are trying to do.

4GB is too small to be useful. You might get away with 8GB. You'd be very well off with 16GB.

There will be very little space for apps. (You can sometimes install apps on the SD card but it's a bit of a pain and not apps will allow it.)

It's probably really slow for maps (and apps) and doesn't use BTLE and will likely never see newer versions of Android.

Galaxy Centura Straight Talk | Prepaid Android Smartphone | Samsung Mobile

• 4GB NAND + 512MB RAM
  
• [h=4]EXTERNAL MEMORY/MICROSD™ CAPACITY[/h]Up to 32GB

wphamilton

This isn't completely true. 4GB is adequate for these apps, but as I said it's under-powered, and under-spec'd for the price in my opinion, but certainly not unusable and not a waste of money. I actually still have only about a third of the internal memory used and the rest free. It wouldn't be good for consuming media, including cloud-streamed music. But I would agree that 8GB with at least 1GB RAM (instead of 512 MB) is a more viable option.

Current Android version is 4.0.4 ("almost" current), probably the last version that will be pushed to it. It's not particularly slow on maps or other apps, but not something to brag about either. I'd spend up to get a Moto-G or something similar unless you're dead set on the Tracphone service.

JohnJ80

What that text in your referenced link is referring to is a system where fixed access points by ISPs are tied to a lat/lon coordinate. So if you are from that IP, your location is known. A lot of that is how when you're browsing certain websites that offer information by you location, they determine that from your IP address. This also can be used to decrease the "time to first fix" as described earlier in that article.

So, to reiterate - if the phone has GPS capability, it is able to receive from the GPS satellite constellation.

As for your veer off of your current plan and your subsequent return to that as stated above, most phones out there from the advent of the current style of smartphone (original iPhone) have GPS. However, if you want bluetooth LE sensors it's going to start with the iPhone 4s and then later (as you noted, Android 4.3 I think + hardware support) for Android phones. I do believe that some earlier Samsung Galaxy phones have ANT+ support but I'd have to defer to someone more knowledgeable on Android.

So unless you can get an iPhone 4s or later (on the iPhone side, that would be the oldest BT LE version) you won't be able to use BT sensors. You will either need to pay more for phone or forgo the whole project if those are the constraints.

Now, for me, I have my iPhone with me continuously. I use it as a SIP phone even for our VOIP service at home. I read books on it. I depend on it for email and other things for work. It's my only phone and I use it for my bike computer. And it's a better bike computer (I think) than I can get even standalone using BT sensors are Cyclemeter. The marginal cost for me is pretty much zero since I'd have the phone anyhow and I'd have to buy the sensors no matter what.


J.

njkayaker

Much of that 4 GB is already being used by the system software.

You really need to know exactly how much is free.

It might just work. The fact that it can take a microSD helps (you should be able to store map data there).

What makes it slow isn't the Android version. It's the processor (and the memory).

wphamilton

I excluded the Android OS use when stating that I have used a third of the available space (after Android is accounted for). I do know exactly how much is free and where the memory is used - ES File Explorer app which I recommend. It's also what I use for moving maps, music and some other data to the microSD card (your surmise is correct). Moving apps on the other hand, even some app cache, is a pipe dream even with the phone rooted. So there are limits.


The processor is fine for these apps. There's no slow down because it doesn't do even the Android simulation of multitasking, except for background processes. You run one app, that's all you get with no switching.

Spld cyclist

I'm giving up. It seems like affordable new phones just don't do what I want them to do (the problem is Bluetooth 4.0 support). Affordable used phones don't either, and it's really hard to be sure that a given used phone will work with an affordable carrier. I'm going to stick with my voice cell phone for a year or so and see what trickles down.

njkayaker

The Motorola G is faster, has much more memory, a much better screen, is a phone that people want, it's not anywhere as limited, has BTLE, for just $120 more. Pretty much, you'll be able to anything you want with the Motorola G.

It's too bad the LTE version of the Motorola G only comes with 8 GB.

It appears that the Motorola G is on the low end of the "high teir" phones.

The Samsung Centura is just cheap (and tied to a weird network?).

=============================

The Motorola E is a nicer phone than the Samsung Cetura is. But 2GB free out of a total of 4GB isn't very reasonable.

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/05/the-best-unlocked-phone-129-can-buy-motorolas-moto-e-reviewed/

njkayaker

You want too much. Cheap, fast, and good. Pick two!

wphamilton

Less than $7/month, the redeeming factor. You're saying the same thing I did earlier.

Btle isn't going to be available on any smartphone of a similar price, not for a while yet. OP has to adjust his expectations or else as he said give up on it.

njkayaker

Well, I said the Centura wasn't a reasonable purchase and you disagreed. For a measly $100 or so more, you can get a nice phone.

It was clear from tgevstart that what he wants isn't realistic for what he wants to spend.

Spld cyclist

If Bluetooth LE was available for it, the Samsung Centura probably would work for me. Maybe in a year BT LE will trickle down to cheaper phones. Maybe not. I can wait.

It's actually not just a matter of spending more for a nicer phone. It's spending more for a nicer phone and then possibly be locked into spending a lot more for the cellular service that happens to work with that phone. That's why the Moto G actually might not be the savior you think it is. It all comes back to being forced to buy a data plan if you want to use a smart phone as a phone. There aren't a lot of options if you don't want a data plan. I haven't yet found such a plan that works with the Moto G. (There is Republic, but their coverage map for my area isn't giving me a warm fuzzy). I'll look a little more, but I'm not optimistic about it.

If I wanted, I could just sign a 2-year contract and get a brand new top-of-the-line phone with a service that has great coverage everywhere. Since those contracts generally are at least $40 per month, I would be spending an extra $288 per year for a service (i.e. data) that I don't need. Does that make sense to you?

So yes - maybe I was being unrealistic about what I wanted to spend. But the spending part is really mostly about the service, not the hardware. It's just the crazy cell phone market in this country, which frustrates the hell out of me.

njkayaker

No phone is a "saviour" (I'm not making that silly claim).

Anyway, the Motorola G gives you more options than the Centura you linked to, which said can only be used with straight-talk. The G is unlocked.

I understand your interest in not wanting to buy a data plan. But, as you are finding out, that's hard to do for ANY phone.

So, basically, the data plan issue is separate from and irrelevant to the "what phone" issue.

Likely, your only practical option would be to buy a smartphone and just use WiFi.

You don't need a "top end" phone (which are $600+ off contract).

Buying the Centura doesn't make any sense when you can buy a good phone for a measly $100 more.

If you get a phone, you might want to do more or try things with it than you do now. The Centura is much more limited than the Motorola G is.

============================

Note that you are mashing two separate questions together.

1 - what smartphone.
2 - whether you can avoid getting a data plan.

I was only answering the first question earlier.

It looks like you can use a non-data SIM in a GSM (not Verizon) smartphone and use it just for voice.

https://www.cnet.com/news/can-you-dit...lan-for-wi-fi/

Spld cyclist

The data plan issue is NOT separate from the "what phone" issue. Phone plans are very specific as to what phones you can use with them. Unless there are other plans I'm not finding that will work with that phone. It might be out there, but I don't see it yet.

Have you tried finding a plan without data for a specific smartphone?

Also, please note that I said in my very first post that I didn't want to be locked into a data plan.

wphamilton

Since you're still going, I did Strava home with the cell reception turned off Bike Ride Profile | Afternoon Ride near Alpharetta | Times and Records | Strava and it worked like normal.

njkayaker has been wrong with just about everything he's said about the Centura phone, but I think he's more or less right that in general only a cutting edge phone is going to have BTLE support.

Options for avoiding data plan are all relatively recent. You've got pay as you go, a few options that I've listed, and that's it. Except for AT&T paygo and Straighttalk all of them appear to use the Sprint network. I'd do the Moto-G with Republic, the $10 no data plan which is what you're asking for. If you don't like the coverage it's back to Straighttalk or Tracphone (which is Verizon, not "some weird network" as someone described it). If you choose Tracphone, it's the Centura, a couple of lower end phones and another of about the same caliber.

njkayaker

There are a few phones that will work on multiple carriers. The iPhone is one of them (it works on CDMA and some GSM networks). They may not be "low end" phones.

Anyway, since you aren't interested in a data plan, it is irrelevant.

Your only option appears to be is to get a generic unlocked GSM smartphone and put a voice-only SIM (a SIM from a voice-only plan) in it. There is some chance that the carrier will detect that it's a smartphone and require you to buy a data plan.

I realize that. I'm not suggesting that you get a data plan.

njkayaker

Nonsense. The G is a much, much better phone without the limitations of the Centura for just $120 more.

Spld cyclist

Thanks for getting back on the gps thing. Good to know.

I looked at Republic, which would be exactly what I need but I'm not confident about coverage here. I'm most interested in Tracfone just because it uses the Verizon network, which is very good pretty much everywhere I go. Tracfone could potentially use the Moto G CDMA version, but they say it won't work with certain branded phones (e.g. Boost Mobile) and I'm not sure the Moto G CDMA phone comes in a "generic" version - I've just seen the branded ones so far, like Verizon and Boost Mobile.

njkayaker

TracFone Wireless - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's a bit weird. It can either use Verizon (CDMA) or GSM. Untill recently, the handsets were locked to the tracfone network.

It's not clear, either, whether the Centura uses CDMA or GSM.

njkayaker

CDMA-only phones might be harder to move between networks. GSM somewhat easier. The iPhone 5 might be the most flexible (the CDMA version also supports GSM) but it's am expensive phone.

How to bring your own phone to another carrier

https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2...riers/2486813/

This is talking about LTE (data). It's possible that the more expensive phones support more bands than the cheap phones.

https://www.buyvia.com/blog/how-to-bu...ed-smartphone/

====================

If you want to use a smartphone without a data plan as a voice phone with the best coverage/service, your best bet appears to be to get a GSM smartphone and use the ATT network (either directly or through an MNVO).

It doesn't appear to be possible (according to the links I provided above) to do voice-only with a Smartphone on Verizon.

Things would be much simpler if you dropped the requirement of wanting to use the smartphone as voice-only.

A smartphone without a data plan is still useful (you just can't use apps that require a data plan to work).

The two networks with the best overall coverage are Verizon (somewhat better) and ATT. (No ones coverage will be perfect.)

The MNVO's that use these networks might have the same coverage (but there can be restrictions/limitations on what the main companies let MVNO do).

The other networks (Sprint, T-mobile, etc) work better in metropolitan areas generally.

wphamilton

I wouldn't bet on it, Moto G with Tracfone that is, but I'm not sure where Tracfone is going with their smartphones. You'd think they'd want to support more current phones, yet maybe they have some reason to hold back.

If the Republic coverage is poor where you'd use it that's a deal killer, which means most of the mobile hotspots like Internet-on-the-go and Karma are all out also (using the same network). But there's something else to research, the Straight Talk mobile hotspot which supposedly can be activated with Verizon. CDMA, I have no idea about pricing or performance.

Straight Talk is decent and not so expensive. Have you looked into those phones?

njkayaker

Yup, weird.

Spld cyclist

Tonight I checked Net10, Boost Mobile, and Straight Talk, all of which require a data plan for a smart phone, and all are $40 or more minimum per month.

Then I found Consumer Cellular, which might be just the thing: https://www.consumercellular.com/Cart/Plans Rated highly by Consumer Reports and PC Magazine, has coverage in my area, AND has the Moto G for $150 (though it's just the 8 GB version). For pricing, talk is separated from text/data. 200 min/month talk is $15 and 1,000 texts + 100 MB data per month is $5. (There are probably some taxes/fees on top of that). It allows you have no data at all, but I would want the texts, and $5 ain't much anyway....

njkayaker

Net10 is tracfone (either GSM or CDMA).

Consumer cellular appears to use ATT's network.

Is the G the LTE one? If you have LTE service for data (and use data), it's much faster.

Prices on Google for the G US GSM):

8gb $180
16gb $200
8gb LTE $220

It looks like you could buy the G elsewhere and use it in consumer cellular.

You could get away with 8gb. Anything reasonable you'd want to try/explore would work with that.

Spld cyclist

Doesn't look like it's the LTE version. I think you're correct that I could buy a Moto G elsewhere and use it with Consumer, so I'll to figure out whether I want to upgrade from the 8 GB phone....

It does use the AT&T network. My wife had AT&T through work a couple years ago and thinks that Verizon is a bit better network-wise around here. I might test it out by buying an inexpensive phone that will work with Consumer and then give the phone to my older daughter if everything works ok (we were going to give her an inexpensive phone this fall anyway). If the network sucks (though I don't think it will), we'll only be out $30 or so on the cost of the phone. Then we'll go to plan B on a different network, TBD.