When i took off the Lugano tires it made a world of difference. I only put conti gatorskins on, but they rolled so much better then the crap schwalbes.

Wrong.

My entire post was discussing both the Dorel takeover and my impressions of the bike. Chronologically, my impressions were made prior to a trip to a PX in Germany where I saw the CAAD10 stocked there. Until that point, I was a believer that Dorel was doing a great job preserving the LBS exclusivity of the brand.

At no point did I rant. However, it has been my experience that many BF members describe opinions and posts they disagree with as "rants", which is a fascinating and academically dishonest means of re-framing the debate. A subtle shade of an ad-hominem argument, if you will.

Scientific or not, impressions are impressions. That and the fact that one can roughly calculate tube thickness by diameter and pitch, and an experienced ear tends to be a decent guage of the end calculated value. And there is the fact that material science dictates the limited means by which weight could be shed off an AL frame. The transition from 6061 to 6069 was done specifically to make tubes thinner in order to draw the weight down. 6069 has the accompanying penalty of being slightly more brittle, but does allow more aggressive tube drawing, hence the weight reduction achievement of the CAAD10. It is what it is, and time will tell if the design proves to be faulty or not.

Since I didn't cite specific reviews (and neither did you), the reviews I speak of are exactly marketing driven. When I say "reviews" I'm talking about website and magazines that pitch themselves as "reviews", not message board comments. And, no one said anything about Cannondale "paying" anyone. You continue to argue with me about things I haven't said, and I don't understand why.

Insofar as the PX is concerned; I think you have an idealized vision of what it is. First, you should probably know that I've been in the military for over 11 years, and have dealt with AAFES extensively both as a consumer and on an organizational level with Base activities. AAFES is a private corporation that barely qualifies as a "service". Without their contract giving them exclusive retail rights to military installations they would rapidly be driven under; they are unresponsive to customer needs, and will provide the minimum level of "services" that will allow them to turn a baseline profit. Trust me, the only time they go out of their way to compete to provide a "quality product" is where it is extremely possible to get one. If not threatened by a Target or a good Wal-Mart, they shrug their shoulders because they know the consumer won't go elsewhere.

Which brings one to the Rammstein PX, located in a place where it is VERY easy to go buy a quality product anywhere BUT the PX. That PX is fairly impressive because it must compete against the plentiful consumer opportunities on "the outside", and because there are lots of military members too afraid to stray from the American retail experience.

I am, however, beginning to understand why this thread describes itself as a "cult".

If that's not a rant, then my definition of the word is all wrong.

Please can you point us to those "reviews".

I have asked for CAAD9 vs CAAD10 comparisons in this thread several times, but no one here seems to have a clue.

Until I see either an experience-based or a detailed objective comparison, I'm going to continue to say that my 9 is better than your 10 simply because my welds look infinitely better :p



(And yes on an unrelated note, I do appreciate the fact that the manufacture and purchase of my 9 put bread on some American families' tables.)

Since I am neither angry, nor explosive, nor violent, nor wildly extravagant, then I am not "ranting". In BF world, however, a rant is defined entirely by one's point of view, and the opposition of the impugned opinion to that point of view.

You will have to take my word, I suppose, that there is no anger in these posts. Simply statements in which anger is read, perhaps due to the implied questioning of the epistemological basis of the "cult".

Well i guess i'm wrong, but as a reader it seemed pretty impassioned.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=caad9+vs+caad10

Spends a few hours reading people's feedback. You will spot a few trends. People who have owned both and agree the CAAD10 is an nice upgrade and improvement (lighter, stiffer, smoother, handles quicker). The other end is people fighting back who always bring up the fact the 9 was the last American made and therefore it is better.

Spend some times around your local crit races where you will find some great first hand experience from people.

BTW your welds are a cosmetic finish that only adds weight.

Unwelded bikes are definitely lighter.

This is true. It was in reference to the CAAD9 smooth welds. :p

It depends on how much duct tape you use

Carbon Duct tape?

lol, even if Banzai is ranting, how does that have any baring on the content of what he's saying?

A rant is simply delivering something in an impassioned way. that doesn't mean he's saying anything inaccurate or biased.

critique the points he makes, don't throw out stupid observations with the intent of discrediting his content.

And for the record, I don't own a CAAD and have no opinion on the matter.

Thanks for the link - will read it.

sorry i didn't spend time typing out a rebuttal to one of his diatribes. How stupid of me.
Although i wasn't even in the argument. Just was commenting on his lack of self awareness.

check my name in this thread…i've written up the differences more than once…I've owned and raced on both, I've also owned and raced on the Soul Faith…all 3 are great bikes…In order my choices are Caad10, Soul Faith…a very close second and the Caad9

for what it's worth I also raced and owned a Supersix Himod and i still have the Caad10 if that says anything.

nice crank

Damn I didn't mean to start an internet fight. Anyway, Cannondale has an Overseas only program for the military. Why? Because I can't buy one online and ship it. That is the only reason why I was able to get one in the PX. I'm not sure they are carried in the U.S. PX's. For one I'm glad, otherwise I would have to pay around hundreds more and have my wife or father ship it over. What a pain in the ass that would be.

The PX in Europe is an agreement, as said to allow service members and their families to get a Cannondale and dorel can ship them through the AAFES to Europe with out violating the no on-line sales agreements. I don't know what set the fly guy off but it was unnecessary to get all balled up about a CAAD 10 being offered in the AAFES system. My metallurgical knowledge tells me that just plinking a tube isn't accurate to any degree. The pitch and timbre of the sound is effected by tube thickness, yes, but also the alloy, the butting of the tubes and several other things. I own and love my CAAD 10 4, it has hit the ground in crashes when cars ran me off the road twice and no dings or dents resulted from the hit. The CAAD 9 is/was a great bike, no questions asked, I'd own one and tried to get one as they were the end of the line for the American made frames. If the CAAD 10 was so poor a performer then why do all the reviews both by magazines and individual owners come out so well?

This wasn't the thread to be bashing the CAAD 10, need to find another place or start your own thread if you don't like the bike.

Bill

As a longtime fan of Cannondale, I - like many - had some concerns surrounding the Dorel takeover. It's hardly necessary to re-visit those; they were once a popular topic among a number of BF members. It appeared though, as time went on, that the concerns were unfounded.

So I was quite surprised when I was TDY to Germany back in Feb-Mar to see some rather nice (and poorly assembled) Cannondales lined up in military Wal-Mart next to the numerous Pacific offerings of the PX. There are, perhaps, two questions that ought to be answered regarding this development.

1) Were Cannondales available at military Wal-Mart PRIOR to the Dorel takeover? If so, then the two are obviously not causally connected.
2) Are Cannondales so impossible to get in Europe? I saw a number of very nice bike shops in Germany, and the only pro-peloton team sponsored by Cannondale happens to be based out of Italy.

And finally, cult members, I am not "bashing" the golden calf. (There...that was a "rant".) I have merely stated that I think there are reasons to be concerned, based on knowledge of the impressive weight reductions achieved on that frame compared to its predecessor, an understanding of the limited means by which that feat can be accomplished, and personal subjective impressions. Take as well the anodized version, and consider the potential effect on an incredibly thin load-bearing substrate by brittle surface anodization. Time, as I stated, would tell if those concerns were valid. They are certainly worth consideration though. I have been intrigued by the vehemence of the responses. One would think I had insulted a child.

Consider for a moment that most cyclists form their impression of the "ride quality" of a frame via a cognitive synthesis of acoustic feedback, a priori expectations, and environmental and/or aesthetic cues. The ridiculous attributes given to, say, wheels on the pages of cycling mags are simply a psychological jumble of these factors dominated by acoustic impression; mathematical modeling often suggests that any differences are below the threshold of human perception. Given this, take "reviews" with as large of a grain of salt as you take my own impressions of the tube construction.

None of this is really a factor for me. I anticipate my CAAD9 lasting until I can't stand it, and then beyond that. Hopefully those CAAD10s will as well.

If you wanted me to "bash" the CAAD10, I'd say something more like; the welds are ugly, and the bulbous tube junction at the headtube looks like a hideous frankenstein-style mess. Now THAT'S some quality "bashing".

Performance bike has some on sale for only $600 a roll

Welcome back to the fold! I didn't ride a bike for 18 years and a CAAD was my choice for a new bike too.

Your bike looks sweet, great color scheme! I'm tired of the played out matte black trend that's in vogue now, almost worse than the red/white/black trend from a few years back...

Cannondales are available in Europe, but you pay in Euro. Priced similarly not equally. 1400 euro equals about $1700, for a 105.

I think we should be careful extrapolating seeing CAAD10 at overseas Px to Dorel positioning their bike as an offering at retail Wal-Mart locations stateside (or elsewhere). A $1500 "toy", which is what most people shopping for bicycle at Wal-Mart consider it as, is outside the typical offering you'd see stocked at a Wal-Mart. Seeing as how demand is fairly high for the CAAD10 in enthusiast circles, it also seems unlikely that Dorel will be willing to tie up the large amount of stocks required to display even just a single CAAD10 in each Wal-Mart store nationwide.

Maybe beating a dead horse, I do enjoy having the "Handmade in USA" plastered on my CAAD9, and that was one of the reasons I bought it. The changes to the CAAD series seem to have largely been evolutionary as opposed to revolutionary, so I wouldn't be opposed to riding a CAAD10, just no need since my CAAD9 is still kicking! :)

Also another option to consider is that without Dorel or a similar company Cannondale would no longer exists or would have went through bankruptcy restructuring again and more US people could have lost their jobs.

I thought it was a little "ove the top and extravagant" there per the webster dictionary it's a rant. On a side note who the hell cares what your opinion is. The guy is excited about his bike and all you did was post with negative comments about how the 9 is better. We have to love the 41, the only place where people S$%^ on someone elses parade.

The CAAD10 is a great bike and I know plenty of people who have upgraded to the new CAAD10 from their 9 and they race just fine at the CAT 3 and 4 level.

I'll be sure to try your scientific "pinging method" to use next time.

Oh and no I am not a dedicated CAAD10 owner. I wanted one but no one had my size so I "settled" for a Tarmac